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Thread: Tom Cat

  1. #301
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    Jan 2013
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    Nice to see! Looking real nice Laurie. I continue to refer to your documentation here as my building guide; just invaluable to me!!!

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  3. #302
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    Dec 2013
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    Yep-Standing ovation from me as well!

    It really does show the overall quality of materials,workmanship and now the paintwork.

  4. #303
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    Dec 2007
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    Toowoomba
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    Default 143 Recoat Topsides

    It's no good...I have to redo the Topsides! Its been a long time since she was painted and there is a marked difference between the Topsides and the latest work. Sigh! I really didn't want to do this but I can't live with it. It's got a very light creamy colour so to me it's showing its age! I'll give her a light sanding and throw another coat on. I just hope I can do as good a job as last time with the finish.
    Laurie - away from the sea

  5. #304
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    Aberfoyle Park SA
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    :c .
    Alan J

    Nothing says "Unprofessional Job" so loudly as wrinkles in the duct tape. - B.Spencer

  6. #305
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    Feb 2008
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    Eustis, FL, USA
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    A few years ago, I was redoing a cockpit paint job (and deck) for a boat I'd built several years previous. It was well cared for, just worn out a bit and needed to be freshened up. There were a few places to repair, so sanding back to raw wood was necessary and since I was spraying, I figured I'd just primer (epoxy) everything, to insure good grip. This went down nice, a little more prep and the two two part acrylic urethane top coats when down, which also looked nice.

    I was using a new 3M sand paper, which was supposed to help with an anti clog additive, which I didn't think much of, as long as it cut good. I've had good luck with 3M, but a couple days later I was taping off around some hardware to apply bedding and when I removed the low tack painter's tape a several inch long section of top coat came up with it. Damn, I figured I hadn't waited long enough, so a few days later I tried again and I pulled off a bigger hunk of top coat. Damnit.

    Suspicious, I did a peel test with a piece of duct tape on the cockpit sole and I yanked off a 3' long hunk of paint. After some serious cursing, I found I could grab the edge of the torn paint and peel huge sections of it off the primer. Double damn. Now, I'm (okay way beyond ), so everything need to come off. About an hour later and a half a roll of duct tape, I got most of the paint off, but found it was still sticking good on the deck. This is when I realized I switched to the new paper in the cockpit.

    I repainted after a good cleaning and scratching, with the old paper and it looked good and was well stuck. The customer loved it. I called 3M and raised holly hell. They informed me the additive to make this new paper non-clogging was a derivative of animal fats. I sent them the 100 sheet pak of paper (okay maybe about 95 sheets) I'd bought with a note, as to which non-speaking bodily orifice they could shove it into. Amazingly enough, they sent me two 100 sheet packs of the stuff I use to use, with an nice letter of apology.

    Long story short, though a different case, I feel your pain. I'm still looking forward to your topside redo. Keep your head up, it could be worse . . .

  7. #306
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    Sep 2012
    Location
    NSW, Australia
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    474

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    My goodness. 8 years and still going. I admire your dedication. The boat will be great when it's done.
    You know you're making progress when there's sawdust in your coffee.

  8. #307
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas, USA
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    3,070

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    Quote Originally Posted by PAR View Post
    A few years ago, I was redoing a cockpit paint job (and deck) for a boat I'd built several years previous. It was well cared for, just worn out a bit and needed to be freshened up. There were a few places to repair, so sanding back to raw wood was necessary and since I was spraying, I figured I'd just primer (epoxy) everything, to insure good grip. This went down nice, a little more prep and the two two part acrylic urethane top coats when down, which also looked nice.

    I was using a new 3M sand paper, which was supposed to help with an anti clog additive, which I didn't think much of, as long as it cut good. I've had good luck with 3M, but a couple days later I was taping off around some hardware to apply bedding and when I removed the low tack painter's tape a several inch long section of top coat came up with it. Damn, I figured I hadn't waited long enough, so a few days later I tried again and I pulled off a bigger hunk of top coat. Damnit.

    Suspicious, I did a peel test with a piece of duct tape on the cockpit sole and I yanked off a 3' long hunk of paint. After some serious cursing, I found I could grab the edge of the torn paint and peel huge sections of it off the primer. Double damn. Now, I'm (okay way beyond ), so everything need to come off. About an hour later and a half a roll of duct tape, I got most of the paint off, but found it was still sticking good on the deck. This is when I realized I switched to the new paper in the cockpit.

    I repainted after a good cleaning and scratching, with the old paper and it looked good and was well stuck. The customer loved it. I called 3M and raised holly hell. They informed me the additive to make this new paper non-clogging was a derivative of animal fats. I sent them the 100 sheet pak of paper (okay maybe about 95 sheets) I'd bought with a note, as to which non-speaking bodily orifice they could shove it into. Amazingly enough, they sent me two 100 sheet packs of the stuff I use to use, with an nice letter of apology.

    Long story short, though a different case, I feel your pain. I'm still looking forward to your topside redo. Keep your head up, it could be worse . . .
    Thanks, very good to know. Was it stearated sand paper by any chance?

    Cheers,
    Rob
    Innovations are those useful things that, by dint of chance, manage to survive the stupidity and destructive tendencies inherent in human nature.

  9. #308
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    Eustis, FL, USA
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    It may have been stearated and was bulk pack (the only way I get paper) 100 count and I think it was called "FreCut" suggesting it was less likely to clog, compaired to other papers. It was a yellowish color, but this was a few years back and I'm not sure about much else. Some of the first generation of the stearated papers gave waterborne and based paints a hard time, but the latest formulations seem better, though I still don't trust them.

  10. #309
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    Default 144 Recoat Topsides Cont...

    Just thought I would share my methodology for prep work before the repaint. I thought I would have a go with the Gator Stripping Pad products in lieu of sanding back with paper products (see pics). They come in different grades and are easy to use. I have a small non-orbital vibrating sander and the pads were just big enough that my sander covered them perfectly. I just added the coarsest grit paper I had to the sander to obtain a reasonable grip on the Stripping Pads and went for it. The finish it gave was excellent but so fine that I wonder if it’s enough – time will tell!

    These are the Pads

    P1010255-1.jpg

    This is how they look with my little sander

    IMG_0278-1.jpg IMG_0279-1.jpg IMG_0280-1.jpg

    These are what I found lying around that require finish coats - nearly forgot them poked behind stuff in the shed. Just goes to show how long its been since I did anything with them!!

    P1010254-1.jpg
    Laurie - away from the sea

  11. #310
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    The "non-woven" pads are actually specific grits and I use them frequently. I live a few miles from one of the Gator plants and can get products direct, but I gave up on them a few years ago and now use ceramic papers. These newer ceramic papers last 5 times longer and though they cost twice as much, in the end a more economical product.

    Pad grits are roughly:
    White is the finest and 1000 - 1200 grit
    Gray a bit coarser at 800
    Maroon is about 400
    Green is about 200

    These pads also come with different abrasive materials, which changes what the grit might be. It's most economical to buy this stuff on a 4" (100 mm) roll (typically ten yards) and cut them as needed. Also different manufactures use different colors and grits, so read the labels. These pads are better for textured surfaces and getting into grooves, etc. They work better than steel wool and don't leave bits of metal around to rust either.

  12. #311
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    Default 145 Recoat Topsides Cont. A …

    Well, time sure has told….my recoats have been a minor disaster. Even with all the prep work the finish is not acceptable by any means. Not only do I see scratch marks from the very fine sanding (320grit) but the finish itself is a cross between flat and gloss. I have nowhere to go with this except experimentation with my rudder pieces.

    - Was the temperature too cold? No…around 27DegC.
    - Did the paint need thinning? No…I can see the very fine scratches!
    - Did the paint even out? No…I see brush marks even though I only rolled and tipped a max of about 24 square inches per change
    - Did I use the recommended thinners to wipe down? No…I used Mineral Turps. Could this be an issue? I dunno, I was just cleaning prior to paint.

    If I hear the word Toplac anytime soon I will have a tissy fit!!!
    Here are some pics of what she will look like without the Sheer Stripe. You cannot see the terrible finish in these photos – thank the man upstairs for small mercies!
    My first real disaster with the build and it would have to be the bloody paint. Am I p..... off! You bet your sweet life!!!

    P1010257-1.JPG P1010264-1.JPG
    P1010259-1.JPG P1010258-1.JPG P1010267-1.jpg

    What I can do right now is clean up the overruns where 'ere they may be and cool off a bit.
    Laurie - away from the sea

  13. #312
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    Temperature is right where it needs to be, how about humidity? Toplac is one of Interlux's new silicone based, single part systems and I don't have much experience with it. This means the thinner will likely be a xylene, not mineral spirits. I don't know if a flow promoter like Penetrol will work with this stuff, but usually if you need to get the paint to "lay down" better, you add thinner, so it can't "stand up" to the brush or roller. As a rule, I stick with products I know, but this isn't much help to you. I called a buddy about your issue and he said he sees this pretty regularly, if you don't use the appropriate Interlux thinners. 216 is their most common one and it does have more than xylene in it, likely benzene or a more refined version like ethylbenzene. His words where, if you use their thinners, you'll get predictable results.

    The idea with these "special" thinners, isn't to rob you, though it sure seems so at times, but to have quite specific evaporation rates, for the paint formulation. I have a chemical background so have no problem fooling around with my own formulations (on lots of stuff), but it can be challenging for the uninitiated. If the thinner is too slow, you can have outgassing while the paint film is geling over or it might prevent the paint from flowing properly, if it's too quick, it'll lay down all right, but usually lose it's "surface tension" and sag or worse.

    Now what. Can you block it down or use a cutting compound to remove the irregularities, eventually buffing to a nice finish? Do you have enough film thickness for this? Usually what I do when in your situation isn't sand it all off, but instead, smooth it up again (you should truly love sanding by now) and try to build up a fair bit of film thickness, knowing it is craps on me again, I'll have enough to block it down and buff it up, without wearing through it in spots.

  14. #313
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    Default Picturs Gone!!!

    Hi Everyone....for those that are not aware this Forum has lost 4 1/2 years of my pictures from day one 6 Feb 2008 thru to 14 Sept 2012. There's nothing prior to Post #150 on Page 10. Whaddyall think? should I decamp and go to the Yankee site - Building / Repair or stick around here and hope two things...

    1) they get the pictures back and
    2) they don't lose even more!

    Its a pity - nearly finished - just the paint, fittings and spars to go with all the initial construction pictures almost gone.
    Laurie - away from the sea

  15. #314
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    Feb 2008
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    Eustis, FL, USA
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    If you go over the WoodenBoat Magazine's site, I'll not follow. That sight used to be rich and full of good folks and lots of professionals, but so much any more. The "bilge" tends to spill over into the other discussion areas and a bunch of self appointed boneheads now reside there. I know of many professionals that no longer post on that sight for similar reasons.

    As to your images, well maybe they've been archived and can be recovered. I would think you still have the images you initially uploaded, right?

  16. #315
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    Aberfoyle Park SA
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    G'day Laurie
    It depends on whether public visibility of the pics is more (or less) important than the boat.
    No discussion board site claims to have unlimited storage space or permanency.
    Some even claim anything you post belongs to them.

    I say the boat is more important.

    In any case, the WoodenBoat mob will be a bunch of (mostly) strangers who have in no way shared the journey.
    I have family in TWBA & hope one day to lay eyes on your boat.

    cheers
    Alan J

    Nothing says "Unprofessional Job" so loudly as wrinkles in the duct tape. - B.Spencer

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