Thread: brick piers??????

Originally Posted by silentC

One option for you might be a kit home.

yeah looked into that but too much this time round.i just rang boral to see what bricks to use and they said any of them would be suitable as their all compressed now anyway so they can stand the load of a tin roof and cladding so im just going to go with it and suffer consequences later if any come up.my point is they use them on the load bearing walls in alot of places then use timber stumps to fill in middle so ill just use them for the whole job a bit overkill but itll be strong and looks like our cheapest option just a hell of alot more work lol

Your building brick piers to take bearers under the house? I skimmed through and think I saw that.

Why didn't you say piers to support floor. I though you were talking about freaking piers to take a roof or fence

Get yourself some 225mm or 300mm plastic pipe storm water? The cheapest you can find.

Dig hole with post hole digger. Push in pipe. Mark all pipes from a datum (determined height) cut off with hand saw so they are all same height. fill with concrete.

Stud frame is lighter than internal brick so shouldn't be too bad.

Ask an engineer to write you a detail for that.
Depending on the soil will depend how deep you go with the pipe piers to take the bearers. It will also determine the centres you will place them.

You will need to put all thread down the centre of them to bolt to the bearers

Alternatively you could lay footing and put pipes then fill with concrete with rods up centre.

In that case mix the concrete yourself for pipe piers.

Place Alcor over piers as ant caps.

Paint Bitcote or Pabcote over top of piers to reduce damp.

White ants don't like bitumen either.

Footings will be N25 concrete

Originally Posted by bingoshelley

snip...
we plan on selling in 6mths after completion so we dont want problems coming up when a little more time and effort now at development stage could save heaps of future grief thx for your advice

you probably don't want to hear this but you're plan casts you as the original builder.
you are on reactive clay
you remain liable for defects for some considerable time (read many years) after you sell the house

If I bought it and discovered a defect I'd pursue for every cent you had or might get in the future to fix the defect.

it sounds as though the only building experience you have is a redimentary at best

think very very carefully about not getting proper and properly documented advice for all aspects of the proposed building.

you could engender a defect by something as seemingly trivial as not properly vibrating the concrete in your piers — a significant risk if you mix the concrete yourself
AND if you do mix yourself how do you demonstrate compliance with the engineer's strength spec?



ian

Originally Posted by autogenous

Footings will be N25 concrete

Auto, what do you mean by N25 ?

Tools

25 MPA concrete.

If their intending on owner building then selling 6 months later its a pointless exercise.

A you cant sell within a 6 year period I think. If you do you will need indemnity insurance to cover the period of say 7 years structural guarantee depending on the state.

Building spec homes as an owner builder isn't a really viable thing when you have those concerns.

Originally Posted by autogenous

Your building brick piers to take bearers under the house? I skimmed through and think I saw that.

Why didn't you say piers to support floor. I though you were talking about freaking piers to take a roof or fence

Get yourself some 225mm or 300mm plastic pipe storm water? The cheapest you can find.

Dig hole with post hole digger. Push in pipe. Mark all pipes from a datum (determined height) cut off with hand saw so they are all same height. fill with concrete.

Stud frame is lighter than internal brick so shouldn't be too bad.

Ask an engineer to write you a detail for that.
Depending on the soil will depend how deep you go with the pipe piers to take the bearers. It will also determine the centres you will place them.

You will need to put all thread down the centre of them to bolt to the bearers

hi autogenius they sound very cheap to do but are they safe they sound flimsy and im more comfortable using bricks as they seem pretty strong.

Originally Posted by ian

you probably don't want to hear this but you're plan casts you as the original builder.
you are on reactive clay
you remain liable for defects for some considerable time (read many years) after you sell the house

If I bought it and discovered a defect I'd pursue for every cent you had or might get in the future to fix the defect.

it sounds as though the only building experience you have is a redimentary at best

think very very carefully about not getting proper and properly documented advice for all aspects of the proposed building.

you could engender a defect by something as seemingly trivial as not properly vibrating the concrete in your piers — a significant risk if you mix the concrete yourself
AND if you do mix yourself how do you demonstrate compliance with the engineer's strength spec?



ian

we have no intention of building a house that isnt safe or will require fixing in the next several years it will be built to last the 50 yrs houses are meant to last.there are a lot of houses built on brick piers in reactive clay soil its just that due to cost and time(mainly) they choose to put brick piers on the outer edges and not in the middle i assumed by doing brick piers everywhere then it would be a more stable house.the pier placings are at 1500 down one side and 1400 down the other do you think this would be insufficent??

Originally Posted by autogenous

25 MPA concrete.

If their intending on owner building then selling 6 months later its a pointless exercise.

A you cant sell within a 6 year period I think. If you do you will need indemnity insurance to cover the period of say 7 years structural guarantee depending on the state.

Building spec homes as an owner builder isn't a really viable thing when you have those concerns.

i dont think owner building to sell is pointless as you only have to live in it for 3mths to legally avoid paying capital gains tax but you cant sell within the first 6 mths as the insurance company will only cover us for 6 1/2 yrs and this insurance has been quoted at $900 by 3 different insurance agencies.as for building spec homes well we live 100+ kms from spec home builders the builders we do have up here have quoted us 250k to build a 15mtr x 8.4 mtr house with 1.8mtr front verandah and 2.4mtr back verandah.weve worked it out at 80k doing everything we can and are allowed to do by law.we have already been offered 195k for the house when its complete so a waste of time i think not.

Shelly
I've searched for and read a few of your other posts

this is how you come across to me

• you have a block of land located in an area with reactive clay soil
• you want to value add by building a house on the block — good on you
• you intend selling within the minimum period allowed by the tax office to avoid capital gains tax, and the insurance company, after the house is finished — if you are living in the house during the final fitout does that period count towards the tax office's 3 months minimum occupation?
• you are so under capitalised it's not funny, remember
  • the $100 toilet?
  • your statement "we looked at a kit home but it's too expensive"
  • readymix is too expensive, so we'll mix it ourselves
• you are using this forum to make up for lack of knowledge / experience in building — nothing at all wrong with doing so, seeking and sharing information is what brings us all together
• you are drawing your own plans or have a student working the drawing program for you — the questions you are asking would be covered on plans prepared by any competent architect-engineer pairing practicing in the area where you want to build.
• you are half expecting the local building inspector to provide you with free advice / guidance — sorry, but any good building inspector will tell you when what you have done is wrong but is unlikely to tell you how to do it right the first time. The best you are likely to get is "that bearer is too small", "there's not enough reinforcing" you will be very lucky to get "you should use a 150 x 100, F17 bearer between those piers". It's all about liability.
• you've been offered some very good advice in respect to building the piers which you haven't as yet comprehended.
• you are goind for the cheapest foundation option witout having researched the market (into which you want to sell the property) to know if a prospective buyer prefers slab on ground construction.

My considered advice to you is
• talk to a few local real estate agents to find out what sorts of houses sell quickly or easily
• find a local architect-engineer pairing familiar with your area, soils and council and PAY them to produce a set of proper plans for you that are suitable for submission to council and contain the detail you need to meet BCA (and BASIX?) requirements.

Then you will be in a position to get quotes for various aspects of the work or to commence construction yourselves.

oh, and don't skimp on survey when it comes to locating the house on the block — you don't want to get to the end and find you have to demolish it because it's too close to, or worse over, a boundary.


Lastly, I wont respond to

Originally Posted by bingoshelley

the pier placings are at 1500 down one side and 1400 down the other do you think this would be insufficent??

ian

Shelly's journey
http://www.byohouse.com.au/forum4/viewtopic.php?t=626

Shelly, I worry about where you get your $80,000 figure from when you don't have your construction method finalised. Don't jump in to far before you get it sorted or you could be in for an expensive ride.

Originally Posted by ian

Shelly
I've searched for and read a few of your other posts

this is how you come across to me

• you have a block of land located in an area with reactive clay soil
• you want to value add by building a house on the block — good on you
• you intend selling within the minimum period allowed by the tax office to avoid capital gains tax, and the insurance company, after the house is finished — if you are living in the house during the final fitout does that period count towards the tax office's 3 months minimum occupation?
• you are so under capitalised it's not funny, remember
  • the $100 toilet?
  • your statement "we looked at a kit home but it's too expensive"
  • readymix is too expensive, so we'll mix it ourselves
• you are using this forum to make up for lack of knowledge / experience in building — nothing at all wrong with doing so, seeking and sharing information is what brings us all together
• you are drawing your own plans or have a student working the drawing program for you — the questions you are asking would be covered on plans prepared by any competent architect-engineer pairing practicing in the area where you want to build.
• you are half expecting the local building inspector to provide you with free advice / guidance — sorry, but any good building inspector will tell you when what you have done is wrong but is unlikely to tell you how to do it right the first time. The best you are likely to get is "that bearer is too small", "there's not enough reinforcing" you will be very lucky to get "you should use a 150 x 100, F17 bearer between those piers". It's all about liability.
• you've been offered some very good advice in respect to building the piers which you haven't as yet comprehended.
• you are goind for the cheapest foundation option witout having researched the market (into which you want to sell the property) to know if a prospective buyer prefers slab on ground construction.

My considered advice to you is
• talk to a few local real estate agents to find out what sorts of houses sell quickly or easily
• find a local architect-engineer pairing familiar with your area, soils and council and PAY them to produce a set of proper plans for you that are suitable for submission to council and contain the detail you need to meet BCA (and BASIX?) requirements.

Then you will be in a position to get quotes for various aspects of the work or to commence construction yourselves.

oh, and don't skimp on survey when it comes to locating the house on the block — you don't want to get to the end and find you have to demolish it because it's too close to, or worse over, a boundary.


Lastly, I wont respond to


ian

ok firstly ive got an architect drawing the plans now.the $100 dunny is off the books.a kit home is out of our range.the local building inspecter has given me his home phone number to ring him if i need help(country here not city so alot more helpful).i have listened to all advice i have been given over various questions in the forum,some i have taken on board some i have not but may in future.prospective buyers may want the slab and glazed windows and whatever else but we dont have the money to do that so if it devalues the house then so be it im not a magician and unfortunately i dont have a money tree.ive already been offered 195k when the house is built as new houses dont get built up here in this town anyway ( 7 in the last 10 yrs all owner occupied) that are put on market to sell.and the people interested know exactly what were building out of.and lastly i was just using this forum to get ideas about what options are open to us i should probably say in my postings ''just enquiring not gospel yet" and yes we have never built before but i know alot of people who have never even picked up a hammer before and have built their own homes so im not afraid to ask a million and one questions and have people thinking im an idiot but eventually we will get it built and im thankfull to everyone who tries to help please dont think im not listening because i wouldnt waste my time on here if i wasnt interested in what advice has been given.such as the toilet and architect.thankyou for your opinion

Originally Posted by Burnsy

Shelly's journey
http://www.byohouse.com.au/forum4/viewtopic.php?t=626

Shelly, I worry about where you get your $80,000 figure from when you don't have your construction method finalised. Don't jump in to far before you get it sorted or you could be in for an expensive ride.

hey burnsy the only thing about construction that hasnt been finalised is the foundations but everything else has been pretty straight forward we know were using timber frame made by truss company 3k for walls 3k for roof trusses.we have a guy coming to do the aluminium cladding 5k the plumbers doing the roof 5k windows are getting made up by a window company 3k as we made mistakes with them.plasterer is doing the plaster 2 1/2 k with our help and we are doing the interior 15k.its just these stupid foundations that were stuck on you cant get quotes when you dont even know for sure what your even going to use.the 80k is pretty spot on for the size house were building but budgets have a way of blowing out so we will deal with that when the time comes.plus plumber and electrician and all the bits and pieces.but im sure were going to make heaps of mistakes along the way which is why im trying to get as much info as i can before we get into it to try to minimise those mistakes.thanks for your concern burnsy much appreciated

The pad depth is as per the soil report.
The pad min. thickness & width is as per as1684 to suit the pier spacings etc
The width of the pad is increased to suit the pier size ( only so the bricks have full bearing )
This is not an uncommon construction method in Tas.
The tie down is possibly the weak point so take the rod down into the concrete pad - you can't rely on the mortar mix for uplift strength.
The termite shielding needs to overhang the pier by 25mm.