Thread: Which Boat To Build

Originally Posted by b.o.a.t.

Given that the original request was
"Construction from plywood, 2 man boat, main sail, jib and spinnaker. No trapeze as this will be a "learning to sail" boat for my kids & wife, up to 14 feet or 4.3 meters.
Might I respectfully suggest that a modern NS14 doesn't fit the bill ?
In fact, the class seems to have developed beyond a "beginners" class & looks more like a mini 18' skiff. With a similar budget required ?
AJ

AJ,
I agree. The argument is that the original NS14 concept would suit the specification to a "t", not the modern evolution of the class.
Cheers
Graeme

Originally Posted by graemet

AJ,
I agree. The argument is that the original NS14 concept would suit the specification to a "t", not the modern evolution of the class.
Cheers
Graeme

Agreed Graeme. What a pity more clubs haven't realised that the mass population entry level into sailing is a budget conscious, family friendly boat with good sea-keeping & manners. Quite aside from other commitments I have on weekends, my main barrier to club racing is the ridiculous cost to be competitive in anything other than Sabres or Paper Tigers. I just keep coming back to the Vagabonds I learnt in, and the Wright Intermediates I raced as a teen-ager. Strict one-design boats that cost couldn't escalate out of reach. We could win races with our 20y/o hull #5 & rigging Mk.1 against brand new boats. Not often, but the boats were similar enough to reward skill rather than depth of pocket.
Something like these perhaps. http://www.dinghy.pl/

Mik, maybe the wrong design was named Eureka ? Maybe it's time to knock up a Pacer analogue with PDR-like fittings, chisel its class rules in stone, & hawk it around the clubs as their salvation from oblivion...
cheers
AJ

WELCOME to the XXXX GOLD BOAT BUILDING PROJECT.



Yep ... they have a link to here.

Here are some links to simple boats that work well
http://www.pdracer.info - simple, cheap sailboat that works
http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans.htm - the mother lode - includes the kitchen sink
http://homepage.mac.com/peterhyndman/eureka/ - simple canoe
http://www.instantboats.com/ - some simple boats including powerboats
http://www.pdracer.com - the best place to look at cheap boatbuilding technology and resources.

There is more general boatbuilding advice under this post.

Originally Posted by graemet

G'day MIK,
I raced NS14s for 30 years and built most of my own boats. I also ran the plans service for the Association when they had one. The first departure from the Javelin was the Analisa which took Spencer's lines and flattened the run aft and dropped the height of the stem. I had a fiddle with this concept with my third boat, at about the time the Angelique plans were released by the Association to replace the Javelin. Latterly, I flew a glass Superoo (Darryl Mannix) shell that I decked in ply. I think I still have the Angelique plans somewhere.
Cheers
Graeme

Hi Graeme,

I've just bought a timber decked, fibreglass hulled NS14 called Hullabaloo, with the number 1316. There are some pictures of it posted here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/39865863@N04/
I'm told I need to replace the deck so I'm hoping to find plans for one. Do you have any idea where I should start? Thanks, Rik

Originally Posted by b.o.a.t.

Agreed Graeme. What a pity more clubs haven't realised that the mass population entry level into sailing is a budget conscious, family friendly boat with good sea-keeping & manners. Quite aside from other commitments I have on weekends, my main barrier to club racing is the ridiculous cost to be competitive in anything other than Sabres or Paper Tigers. I just keep coming back to the Vagabonds I learnt in, and the Wright Intermediates I raced as a teen-ager. Strict one-design boats that cost couldn't escalate out of reach. We could win races with our 20y/o hull #5 & rigging Mk.1 against brand new boats. Not often, but the boats were similar enough to reward skill rather than depth of pocket.
Something like these perhaps. http://www.dinghy.pl/

Mik, maybe the wrong design was named Eureka ? Maybe it's time to knock up a Pacer analogue with PDR-like fittings, chisel its class rules in stone, & hawk it around the clubs as their salvation from oblivion...
cheers
AJ

I wholeheartedly agree with you AJ. I'm very new to club sailing and I'm really surprised at how poor the participation rate is. My kids have both played soccer and even the small clubs around here have scores of junior members. Their club has almost a thousand. Meanwhile there are only about thirty active juniors at their first sailing club and their seems to be less at another club where we recently did a clinic. In year 5 or 6 I built a two person tobogan that wasn't technically much simpler than the PD looks to build. And, given the price of them, I really think you're right. The PD could well be a way to greatly increase sailing as a sporting option. And whether or not existing sailing clubs are interested,surely schools, PCYCs and other organisations could be approached to get involved.

I'd be interested in putting a little time into it over here in NSW, if anyone wanted to float the idea.

Rik,

Have a look at the "Firebug" at the excellent web site at

www.firebug.co.nz

This little beauty was designed by the late John Spencer who designed many of the best known small perfomance dinghies over his lifetime.He was an expert at getting small boats to perform.

Firebug was conceived not long before he died & demonstrates this great designer's passion for making affordable boats available for all to able to build to get people back into sailing,be it to race or just for fun.The class has a clear set of rules which will keep boats competitive but not stifle minor design changes.

They are catching on in Sydney with several already at Ryde/Concord sailing club & had a stand at this year's Sydney Boat Show with a couple of boats under construction for all to see.

If you have the latest copy of AABB there is an interesting article there & lots more in previous editions otherwise their web site is chock full of information & pictures.

This design has really caught on & hundreds have been built.

Al

Originally Posted by ausie

excellent web site at www.firebug.co.nz ... small boats to perform.... affordable boats available...catching on in Sydney ...hundreds have been built. Al

They are a good looking boat with a very catchy name and very good website. I particularly like the links for community + school promotion. One thing I couldn't find on the site though was a measurement of performance (ave speed, top speed, or something) or a price.

I did read that "the cost is about one third the cost of a similar sized ready to sail boat" but no actual estimate of price, which I'd like because, frankly, 1/3rd of a similar sized readymade is still a lot of money for lots of people. That's one of the very appealing things about a self build PD. It costs a few hundred. Most kids and parents could afford that and my sailing club which isn't in a wealthy part of town could afford many more boats. Do you know the cost and performance?

Either way though, this low cost intro is one way to go to boost sailing juniors. Has anyone mounted a serious promotional push yet?

Rik,

Give Ryde/Concorde a bell & get a lead to one of the boats that have sailed there.

Failing that,contact Peter Tait in NZ at Firebug HQ.I have spoken with him in the past & he is very forthcoming with information.

I remember reading on their site that it costs about $900-$1400 to build depending how much you make yourself(they have plans for all the fittings if you want to make your own).Many people seem to buy the mast,rigging & sail direct from NZ so it must be good value.

Peter would give you leads to all the OZ builders.

As far as speed goes,they are only 8' so are limited,but reading all the reports from NZ,they seem to handle heavy weather well without coming apart.John Spencer was one of the better designers of our time.

Go back to their site & look under "builder comments".You'll find many references to heavy weather sailing especially one towards the bottom from a fellow in Sydney.

Al.

Hey Basicc,

I to am about to start a build with my son (hopefully soon anyway) but I looking at a Touring canoe with outriggers that I intend to make into covered platforms. From what I have researched I will be able to take it out into a number of conditions although I only intend to keep it on the lake. I think the idea of building something with my son is something I am truly looking forward to as it will be an excellent bonding exercise (hopefully) I am looking to get my father-in-law into it with us as well (plus he has the huge shed) I would be interested in knowing what you finally settled on and would love to see some pics

I guess I'm the enthusiast for Firebugs in Sydney referred to on the Firebug.co.nz website.

I've sailed mine hard for three years and no breakages. Not bad! Apart from my ninety kg, she is often used by juniors who find her more challenging than the Sabots, but requiring less weight than the Spirals. Her 9mm thick bottom makes her pretty tough, it makes her incredibly easy to build too.

I've also given numerous sailing lessons to other adults, with no drama; not bad for an eight footer.

Her speed is restricted by her size, but she planes surprisingly easily and is the most manouverable boat I've sailed in fifty years. She handles conditions on the Parramatta river, ferry washes and all easily but I have not taken her to sea.

We hope to send a team to the South Island (NZ) champs in 2011.

My son plans to build one at Christmas, he should get the woodwork finished in a week and another week for painting. It's so quick because you can pre-asemble components before adding them to the basic structure, thus glue can be curing on one job while the next is worked on.