Thread: Strip Built TK1

Only needs one word.........beautiful.

You are an artist as well as a kayak builder.

Looks magnifico AN! Well done.

A few questions if you don't mind:
I'm not familiar with the specs for these things - what are the LOA and beam?
What was the transport cost for the Paulownia (I'm assuming it came from near the NSW/Qld border) and approximate quantity? (I'm in SA but it might give me some idea of what to expect)
Did you have any trouble using 4mm strips? Most info sites seem to recommend 6.4mm with some down to about 5.

I particularly like the WRC highlights design - looks to be simpler to do than some but the result is just as impressive.

A lovely missile!

Good weight achievement too.

With my Balsa Canoe I found that glass made by far the biggest contribution to weight. You compare the weight of removing a couple of millimetres of wood compared to halving the glass weight over most of the area and it makes a very sizeable contribution.

Ended up going with half your Glass weight but doubling it where I sat and also where the boat would touch the ground on the bottom.

I was prepared for the boat to be very prone to damage, but it still looked good when I sold it a few years later. It did have some tiny bog repairs where the glass had been punctured over about 3 years of use. But nobody would ever see them unless they were looking really carefully.

I don't think it makes any real difference to the durability - I think Paulownia is a much better option for real boats than balsa - much less dent prone.

Later read the Guillemot site that they had found that two layers of half the glass weight is stiffer and more resistant to denting than one of the same weight. Makes good engineering sense.

You happy with how it paddles? Must be very distracting for the competition to have something so pretty to look at!

Any pics of the build? Wonderful thing!

Best wishes
MIK

Originally Posted by labr@

Looks magnifico AN! Well done.

A few questions if you don't mind:
I'm not familiar with the specs for these things - what are the LOA and beam?
What was the transport cost for the Paulownia (I'm assuming it came from near the NSW/Qld border) and approximate quantity? (I'm in SA but it might give me some idea of what to expect)
Did you have any trouble using 4mm strips? Most info sites seem to recommend 6.4mm with some down to about 5.

I particularly like the WRC highlights design - looks to be simpler to do than some but the result is just as impressive.

TK1 Specifications
Max Length - 457.2cm
Min Gunwale Beam - 58.5cm
Min Waterline Beam - 50.8cm
Over stern rudder. TK1s are not permitted to have under hull rudders (as are K1s).

Freight is an interesting issue. The length of the strips makes a big difference.
When I bought 3.3 metre strips for a 5.5 metre SOF, the freight was $63 on $80 worth of timber.
Freight on 2.1 metre strips for a 4.5 metre kayak was $49.
Freight on 1.8 metre strips for a 5 metre kayak was $24.
If you contact John White here,
http://www.paulownia-timber-sales.com.au/Contacts.htm
you will find him very helpful.

The thinner strips made some things easier and created no problems.
This builder uses 3/16" strips all the time.
http://www.laughingloon.com/shop.tips.html
That is just under 4.7mm

I have done sweeping curves with accent strips and panels, but I have learned that it is much quicker to follow the lines dictated by the strips and I think it still looks good.

What was the transport cost for the Paulownia (I'm assuming it came from near the NSW/Qld border) and approximate quantity? (I'm in SA but it might give me some idea of what to expect)

labr@

Yes your right about the source of Allans Paulownia. Allan makes his own strips from rough sawn timber. The weight of the paulownia he uses varies a little from craft to craft but to give an idea of freight costs a 15 kg bundle of timber, nothing longer than 3.5 metres, would currently cost $57.00 to $60.00 including packing to Adelaide or the IPEC depot there. It jumps up considerably if it has to go outside the suburbs.
Hope this helps.
John

Boatmik
I weighed the timber hull and deck before glassing. They weighed 2.4 and 1.5kg respectively. As the kayak has 4 square metres of area and assuming I sanded the strips down to an average of 3.5mm, that agrees with the figure of 285 kg/cu metre for Paulownia.

I am very pleased with the way it paddles. I hope it is as fast as the TK1s I used to paddle a few years ago. It is definitely more stable. According to the theoretical calculations, by slightly reducing the rocker, I have a kayak with a tiny bit less drag but more stability.

I have attached a few photos of the construction.

Originally Posted by anewhouse

... and I think it still looks good.

Darn right it does!

Thanks for the info Allan and John. I'm still just a wannabe at this stage but the interest level just went up another notch. Might need to start lobbying the chancellor of the exchequer soon.

Oh wow....
looks more like a missile on the water than off it.
One seriously good looking boat.
cheers
AJ

Wow Anewhouse, that is (as has already been said) amazing!

Great looking design. Do you intend to race it, or is it just for general paddling. Wahat did you use for a seat, and did you make the tiller and rudder components yourself?

I have built David Payne's ply TK1, but found it too high volume and not as fast as current production TK1's (glass/kevlar/carbon). I am about to start on a stripper one, designed by David Payne again (I'm sure he'll sell you the plans he designed for me!). Looks a lot lighter and less surface area due to the corved hull.

I'm using 3.5 mm WRC so will be interesting to see how the weight compares with your paulownia one.

Sadly, won't get it done in time for the Masters so will be in a snot boat, but I'll get it done soon (just need to finish a Night Heron first). May be up for a race )

Regards,
Darren
(in Melbourne, but I'll travel to north NSW to paddle with another strip TK1!)

Darren
I have already competed in one local race last Saturday, but unfortunately none of the people I had paddled near in another race a couple of months ago in my clear PVC SOF were paddling, so it was difficult to be sure of the speed of this kayak. I am fairly sure it is about the same as something like a Sabre. Time will tell.
If I tell you I averaged about 8.9 km/h for 10 kilometres, that won't sound very fast, but I only managed 8.7 km/h in my quite narrow 5.5. metre SOF, so the lack of speed is more the fault of the paddler than the craft. I seem to remember that 20 years ago I struggled to maintain over 9 km/h for an hour in the Sabre.

However, I just remembered I am not the slowest old bloke around, or at least I wasn't. When I competed in the 6th Australian Master Games in Canberra, I finished in the middle of my group in each of the distances in a Sabre TK1.

I will have the opportunity soon with the cooperation of my son and my brother to compare this TK1 with the Sabre and also with my sea kayaks, so I will give an updated performance report when I have completed that.

The seat is laminated fibreglass using a mould i took off a K1 seat about 10 years ago. I also included a layer of fabric to produce a nice pattern on the seat, but I couldn't eliminate the wrinkles in the fabric, so it looks a bit rough and is therefore not featured in any of the photos. However it is very light. I made box of scrap strips to elevate it off the hull and attached it to the hull with velcro. That was the lightest way I could think of to make the seat.

I made all the rudder, the tiller bar and the footrest from wood. Most of it has a glass skin except for the rudder blade. I thought there might be some advantage in trying to make it the weakest part of the rudder assembly. Some parts I became obsessive about reducing weight. I even made the tiller bar from Paulownia and made it a U shape the save a gram or two. I would have liked to have access to the equipment to make a hollow stainless steel pivot for the rudder, but just used a SS bolt, so I was a bit inconsistent with my obsession. I suppose I just did what I could.

About ten years ago, someone from the Burley Griffin Canoe Club in Canberra made a S&G TK1 which I am pretty sure was a David Payne design. I seem to remember that he was a little disappointed at how heavy it was and I remember it certainly was slower than all the Sabres, Vipers and Sladecraft around at the time.

If we assume that you will sand your 3.5 mm strips to an average of 3 mm, the timber in your WRC hull should weigh should weigh between 3.9 and 4.2 kg, assuming density between 330 and 350 kg/cu metre.

Hi,

Thanks for the info. I also have a Sabre so will do a comparison myself (although I paddle a Vector when racing...just that bit faster). 8.9km/h is a reasonable speed in the Sabre - not the fastest but it still paddles well against newer ones and is pretty stable in chop and a wash. 9.5km/h is a decent pace for that distance so the stip one should hold its own against production ones.

The ply TK1 in Canberra may have been one of David's - he designed it around 10-12 years ago I think. I used 3mm ply for the hull and 1.5mm for the deck, with 125gsm glass on the outside, but it still came out a lot heavier than I would have liked and with the slab sides and min. waterline beam it came out pretty high volume. It paddles well but not a rocket, especially these days.

Thanks for the seat and fittings details. Rudder assembly looks great - hope mine comes out half as nice!

I expect a lot more out of the strip one, with lighter weight and better shape so will keep you posted on progress.

Are you competing in the WMG in October?

Regards,
Darren

Originally Posted by labr@

Darn right it does!

Thanks for the info Allan and John. I'm still just a wannabe at this stage but the interest level just went up another notch. Might need to start lobbying the chancellor of the exchequer soon.

Certainly can't run afoul of She Who Must Be Obeyed

This is the type of craft that would go great touring on Pumicestone Passage, in stead of the plastic kayaks I see each day. I enjoy your comments on its construction. As a Mature + aged member this would be an ideal project - unfortunately it would not accommodate my size or agility. More strength to you.