Thread: Is radiata pine that bad!

I dunno... the grain on the Myrtle bowl is beautiful, whereas the radiata's grain is much more loose and less attractive, IMO.

Still, I see your point - the radiata bowl still looks quite nice.

Cheers,
Dave

Other timbers can have better looking grain (subjective personal opinion) and better colour (subjective personal opinion) but it suffers from being common (fact) and we all remember the saying that familiarity breeds contempt.

Wait until exotic timbers are impossible to get (or illegal to mess with) and the cost of plantation timber goes through the roof due to transport costs. Then you might see more Radiata Pine.

Maybe...

Cheers,
Adam

You have obviously done a great job with you had. It is only a small piece, turned and stained so it looks fine. But radiata pine on its own in a larger scale does look very ordinary.

Alot of the furniture I see in stores here in NZ are made of stained pine. All manufactured in China with NZ pine. It works out cheaper to send raw pine to china to make the furniture and send it back than it does to make the furniture here. Its a very tough market for furniture manufacturers here.

Im not a big fan of pine being used in furniture mainly because its soft (especially nz grown radiata pine) and dents easily. And the fact I see it everywhere I go.

Nice bowls. Radiata is the worlds most common wood for good reason. -Grows fast nearly anywhere, mills easily, dries well and quickly, easy to work with, glues screws and nails well, takes any finish, strong across the grain, light...etc. Nothing crapiata about it. Nice to see it get a bit of praise on the forum Chipman because it is an excellent all round timber. Er, lacks character though.

Pine is ok, just not for a primary wood on "fine furniture", same as oregan. Its just not hardy enough for a piece to last generations, but quite fine for everyday furniture.

But,
Pine grain can be used to be quite spectacular, quarter sawn looks very nice on rails and stiles and flat sawn looks good on field panels.
Many knock crapiarta only because it is common(as Chumley said)and is available as the main furniture wood cheaply at discount stores so they think its cheap... what a surprise they get if they go to a timber merchant and ask for clears grade pine(its dearer than many hardwoods).
Another problem that I've and many others have encountered is the dreaded warpage it has, its because of two reasons
1. Most is only to construction specs(dried super fast and still half wet)
2. Very little store brought pine is quarter sawn, as its cut for the most yield... flat sawn which warps like buggery.
I have pine thats been machined several years ago... still straight as the day it was machined, its quarter sawn and was fully dried before machining.(its a shop straight edge)

Another problem is staining, many have trouble getting an even colour... bit of know how and practice fixes that!

Len, I fail too see what you mean by "Er, lacks character though." its has heavily featured grain just like oregan... to me most common use hardwoods lack character compared to the pines.

I think a lot the opinion directed towards pine is based on perception of social standing, a bit like why Jamie Packer doesn't drive a commodore or falcon.

Ive seen some really nice RP pieces. The Scandanavians apparently love RP because of its yellowing.

Both are very nice pieces Chipman.

Having actually turned these two bowls (as a novice), I can tell you it was much easier to turn the myrtle (large pile of long strands on the floor) and the grain looks nice. Staining was a simple and straight forward affair. This was a wedding gift on behalf of my mother and so it had to look good of itself. From memory the blank cost me about $30.

The radiata pine bowl was harder to turn an required a lot of careful sanding both while on the lathe and after taking off (along the grain) to try and get an even staining. I think most of us have experienced the problems of blotchiness when staining pine, especially on the end grain. It was an offcut of construction grade pine so was of minimal value. It was part of a gift for a departing teacher at school... it was really just a container to hold the goodies inside... lots of chocolates and other little treats. So really, its appearance was not of prime importance. Surprisingly the teacher valued the bowl more than what was inside it!

I am interested in what ARTME said about pine and the Scandinavians. All our bedroom furniture is natural finished pine at SWMBO's request... and I quite like it to and the natural yellowing effect that occurs over the years. I also make clocks and her favourite clock after the grandfather clock is a natural finish pine clock made as an experiment in the process of perfecting the design of a clock to be made out of fiddleback redgum.

I am not sure I agree with Wongo.... I have some large pieces of furniture made out of stained radiata pine (all my lounge/dining room furniture and it looks good (table top clear pine, frame and chairs effectively clear construction grade pine from bunnings) I suspect it is the careful selection of the pieces that has contributed to the overall look. KORDES is certainly right about it being soft and easily marked and to that end, I would never choose it for high class furniture (as we have seen from WOODWOULD'S posts WOW!!!!) In that sense I agree with HARRY72. In another way I agree with WONGO, there are wood species around that to me are much more attractive with a natural finish (rather than stained)

I think that those of you that think that there is snob value associated are right too but apart from the cheapness of the pine, the problem is made much worse by the rubbish quality you see made out of pine in the cheap furniture places... bad quality workmanship. I have also seen a lot worse quality in imported "Antique Mahogany" furniture too.

Another issue when comparing timbers is the design limitations place on you by the properties of the timber. Good quality hardwoods enable you to work with smaller sections and intricate shapes and pine is certainly not a timber for carving fine detail. In pine's favour, the whole problem of differential expansion and contraction is less of an issue.

I guess it boils down to:

Your budget,
The required design
The skills of the person doing it and their attention to detail
What you or your customer likes

As CHUMLEY says, the day will probably come soon enough when all we will have to work with on any large scale will be cheap plantation timbers like radiata pine. Pine might not be the most exciting timber but its tag as CRAPRIATA PINE is a little undeserved.

Cheers,

Chipman

I agree - very well executed, and each to their own taste, interests and budgets.

Personally I dislike staining and even a lot of finished like oils and waxes that end up darkening timber too much. I prefer to see the grain/timber as nature had intended us to see it.

One of the main reasons I took up home milling was so I didn't have to work with a limited set of timber (and to see the real grain on the immediate opening up of a log). After 12 months of milling I have a choice of several different red gums, tuart, apricot, jarrah, banksia, camphor laurel, sheoak, QLD Box, cedar, black locust, and coming up I have more jarrah and sheoak, lemon scented gum and wandoo. My main use of PR these days is for stickers, the sticks that go in between the milled slabs.

When I first started milling I was concerned that I would not have anything to mill. One year later and I'm now turning down about every second offer of logs. I can also appreciate that not every one can or wants to do this.

There are also lots of other ways to get interesting timber. Council pickups, building skips and recently I have been able to access some of the best bits out of two 40+ year old timber collections from two older WW friends who have moved into retirement villages.

Cheers

Hi Bob,

You and your wood!! You are going to make us all a little green

But good on you. It just goes to show if you really want to do something, you will get out there and do it.

Some of the most interesting bits of wood I have collected, have come from my father in law's wood pile. It is amazing what goes up in smoke. Others have given me bits and pieces and in return I make things for them and that tends to bring more wood and then others get involved and everyone wins.

Keep on cutting and posting your pics, I enjoy seeing what you are cutting and doing. While I am not into milling myself, My grandfather was a cocky sawmiller in North Eastern Victoria so it is sort of in my blood a bit as I remember working with him as a teenager.

Cheers,

Chipman

Wood is wood is wood.
Different woods, different looks.
Each has its own feel and beauty.

I love pine when it has a clear finish and allowed to yellow off in the sun.

My BBQ area has pine doors on the cupboards which have very nicely matured to a golden colour.

Originally Posted by Chipman

Some of the most interesting bits of wood I have collected, have come from my father in law's wood pile. It is amazing what goes up in smoke.

I know exactly what you mean. Was staying at a country pub recently and was intrigued at some of the wood being tossed on the open fire, it turned out to be sheoak. Log must have been 1m in diameter! Raced out the back and there was this two trailer load pile of sheoak all cut up for the fire. I couldn't bear to look!