Thread: Australia Day

if you're worried about it going south - I'm not sure why you started it then??


The only way to get balanced discussion here is unfortunately to make sure you have a balanced representation. Given the huge population imbalance, this little niche in the interwebs is, as most are, a most unlikely places to get appropriately balanced commentary. I know I have none of the answers you seek but recognise the dichotomy of this day

I can see the point of many activists and don't disagree with their objectives, but unless you can present something physical than can be turned into legislation not much will happen.
Climate change a good example, some say the science is settled - OK publish it in a concise form and let it be audited.
I support looking after our planet, but still waiting for the HOW on a global scale.
Same goes for 26th in it's own way.
Sometimes the most passionate activists are the people who set their own cause back by losing the attention of the majority who don't want anything to do with radicalism.
Prob a bit more than 2c worth.

I grew up on a farm in country QLD and moved to Brisbane 20 years ago, so I have been exposed to a range of different values, not sure this qualifies me but here is my 2 cents.

I was born here and took living in Australia for granted and did not realise this until I went to a citizenship ceremony. Immigrants at the ceremony were really proud and happy to become citizens. At this point I thought I realised didn’t understand how much immigration and citizenship meant to people nor could
I understand how much being an aboriginal means.

In my opinion If the traditional owners want the date changed bring it on.

A date that appears to bring hurt to a segment of society for a reasonable reason should be changed. Just remember Easter is I different date every year.


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There are a number of articles written by Warren Mundine where he states that the majority of First Australians are quite happy with the date and don’t want it changed.

You can please some of the people some of the time but you cannot please all of the people all of the time.

Are some of the activist just causing a commotion just for change?

How come some councils believe that we should not celebrate Australia Day (or Queens Birthday Holiday) but still shut their doors on that date?

Perhaps the answer is that just about every public holiday will offend one section of the community, then perhaps we should not have public holidays.

If you want to change the date from January 26, (Arrival of the first fleet) then what date that will not upset someone else would you suggest? Currently it is summer and just before the start of a new school year.

I am proud to be Australian and thankful for where I live having been born here and never left. I have not endured what others have to come here, or what they have left behind. While this country is not perfect, it is not too bad either.

I do not have any answers, only more questions and comments.

Is the specific date of Australia Day (26 January)significant in itself? It may not be as steeped in history as we are led tobelieve. I extracted this information from Wikipedia.

1. Whilst there were some celebrations as early at1818, the occasion was not known as “Australia Day” and celebrated in that veinby all states until 1935
2. It was not until 1994 that this day wasconsistently a public holiday and celebrated by all states.
   

If changing the date would mean little to any impliedoffence, then it matters little either way. It would seem to me that for manypeople (a very casual remark on my part) providing there is still a public holidayassociated the great unwashed don’t really give a monkey’s toss when it occursother than a Monday may be the preferred time.
This year is a good example where the holiday is earmarkedas the following day.

Back to my original question and the answer is probablyalong the same lines as birthdays. Some significance, but birthdays don’tusually create too much offence, although some births could arguably bedeclared undesirable.

I have a friend who is passionate about Australia Day andAnzac Day . They are the days of the year where the prime objective is tocompletely write himself off.

If Australia Day moved to a different day there is probablyno real issue. However, if there was a move to create another day ofcelebration with indigenous significance it would mean an extra holiday and Ican foresee intense debate over that by both the government and the businesssector. The public from their part may be unwilling to relinquish one of theother public holidays in “payment.”
I appreciate I have not really posed any answers to thequestion: Merely raised issues without solutions!

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by forrestmount

In my opinion If the traditional owners want the date changed bring it on.

A date that appears to bring hurt to a segment of society for a reasonable reason should be changed.o

Further, if someone wants to argue they shouldn't be offended/hurt by the date because we are now a different country/people/whatever then the reverse of that argument must also be true: changing the date shouldn't be a problem because we are a different country/people/whatever.

Republic Day has a nice ring to it. 26 July would be super.

Originally Posted by q9

Republic Day has a nice ring to it. 26 July would be super.

weather is too cold for a BBQ

Originally Posted by Tonyz

weather is too cold for a BBQ

... said nobody in Queensland, ever!

Just for a moment I'd like you to imagine that we lost WW2. Another foreign government now runs the joint. Some of us spent our childhood fishing and walking in the Ku-Ring-Gai National Park North of Sydney and many still do. It's a beautiful place and its ours.

Now imagine that our foreign rulers declare that the area will be developed to provide accommodation for their retirees from the Northern hemisphere and all Australians would be banned from entering. You could be shot if you try. By the way, Australians are now treated as an underclass and imprisoned at a much higher rate than our masters, especially when we get a bit uppity or take to the drink to soothe our hurt, or kill time when we can't find work.

How would you feel? Not all that flash I imagine. I, for one, wouldn't feel like saluting their flag or celebrating our loss in the war. Some might, but not me.

mick

Originally Posted by Glider

Just for a moment I'd like you to imagine that we lost WW2. Another foreign government now runs the joint.

and


How would you feel? Not all that flash I imagine. I, for one, wouldn't feel like saluting their flag or celebrating our loss in the war. Some might, but not me.

mick

That's exactly what happened in WW2 in the Nazi occupied countries of Europe. Except it was worse then the way the British treated the Aboriginals.

As an immigrant I sympathize with them and don't agree that the date of the landing of the first fleet should be the day for celebrating the coming together of the various colonies to form the Commonwealth of Australia which was on the 1st of January and not the 26th.

So why don't we change it to take their view into account.

Peter.

Originally Posted by forrestmount

Just remember Easter is I different date every year.

That's because Easter is calculated on a lunar cycle

Oh goodness, only the names and places have been changed to protect who knows whom.

We have similar problems except from American Natives (Indians), African Americans, Armenians, Jews, Latino Citizens, Irishmen, Italians, Illegal Immigrants, etc. I can't remember all of them. They all want something. It seems little and insignificant at first but the intent is to eventually arrive at almost full control. (It's how the Evangelicals got us Trump, but I digress.)

So my friends, the way to look at it is like this. We have a tree, keeping in a woodworking theme, the California Redwood. Some of these Redwoods have been growing for over 2000 years and if you have ever been in a Redwood forest, you feel rather insignificant.

Then along comes little Johnny with his Boy Scout hatchet intent upon cutting this magnificent 2 M in diameter tree down. Little Johnny starts to work with his hatchet, a whack here, a chip there and his mum calls him in for dinner. This continues every day for 10 or 15 years until finally the tree falls. Did little Johnny accomplish anything? Of course not but he destroyed.

Here, when they get their way, we all lose a little bit. While the real answer is to fit in and try to conform. When every one works toward being part of a single society it is better for everyone. Or put another way, When in Rome do as the Romans do.

When it comes to changing a calendar date, there is the one that almost everyone would appreciate and is temporary and lasting only 8 years. When one becomes a teenager, subtract 8 from the year of their birth. Then 8 years later, restore their birth date to normal. As a benefit this process would destroy the illegal business of manufacturing phony identification cards.

Originally Posted by rrich

We have similar problems except from American Natives (Indians), African Americans, Armenians, Jews, Latino Citizens, Irishmen, Italians, Illegal Immigrants, etc. I can't remember all of them. They all want something. It seems little and insignificant at first but the intent is to eventually arrive at almost full control.

Yes, they all want to not be treated as second class citizens by a bunch of bigots.

What do they all want that bothers you so much? Name one thing for each group you mentioned. I'm also curious as to why you've left off a few very vocal/prominent groups from that list; sorry, but I don't believe for a second you 'forgot' about the non-straight/non-binary community and I'll bet you didn't forget the Muslims either.

I'd also like to know what you feel you've lost in the process. Go on, I'll wait.

The intent is to arrive at full control? The f*** it is.

When every one works toward being part of a single society it is better for everyone.

That's true, but just telling everyone to conform and ignoring cultural differences is definitely not better.

And in the interest of full disclosure, I'm Jewish.