Thread: Presumption Of Innocence

Originally Posted by silentC

I wonder if they'll give him back his visa? I wonder if he'll still want it!

No apparently there are "other matters" that we're not allowed to know about that mean he can't have his visa back (according to Andrews).

Originally Posted by TE

[quote=TEEJAY;553829

.

BTW I wish you were right.

Its hard to know who is right these days because we are fed a lot of lies and misinformation by our politicians via an obliging media, which brings me back to why its important to enshrine freedoms... in this case the freedom of the press to tell us the truth (i'm refering to the anti-sedition laws) not that there seems to be any free press left in this country.

Thanks Rupert et al

Originally Posted by craigb

No apparently there are "other matters" that we're not allowed to know about that mean he can't have his visa back (according to Andrews).

"A rowdy protest group has formed at the Brisbane Magistrates Court demanding compensation for the doctor, who has been in custody for 25 days."

Wonder how much he will get if anything?

Ahh the many twists and turns of the department of immigration they will most likely turn a 1 million dollar compensation into 7 million

If I was him, I would sit out detention and let them send me back to India and never set foot in this country again.

[quote=Bleedin Thumb;553868][quote=TE




Its hard to know who is right these days because we are fed a lot of lies and misinformation by our politicians via an obliging media, which brings me back to why its important to enshrine freedoms... in this case the freedom of the press to tell us the truth (i'm refering to the anti-sedition laws) not that there seems to be any free press left in this country.

Thanks Rupert et al[/QUOTE]

Yep truth is often lost in the sale of a paper or news story.

I like the freedom to bear arms, but hey that hasn't done so well either, I still like it

Originally Posted by silentC

If I was him, I would sit out detention and let them send me back to India and never set foot in this country again.

Can be a long time - detention works in years not day or months.

Where he is from is not appealing to him either. He seems to have support of his workplace and many around him here. If he went through this by his own govt in his own country I doubt it would rate a mention in their news.

Travel oversaes and they laugh at our news it is so preoccupied with trivial issues such as the rights of one person - in their country it is about many deaths/slavery/real terrorism/plague all real juicy stuff not the fluffy feal good stuff we become so obsessed with.

Hicks would have been shot in the paddock.

Originally Posted by silentC

If I was him, I would sit out detention and let them send me back to India and never set foot in this country again.

I was going to suggest that I would take up arms.... but then I read Teejays post and realised that Im not allowed to.

Originally Posted by Bleedin Thumb

... If we can't deal with a terrorist investigation using existing intelligence and investigative measures then..........

Intelligence???? Didn't the government sack the only intelligence agent we have that got the WMD info on Iraq correct (Andrew Wilkie). By rights, they should sack the whole ONA (is that what it's called?), re-employ him and listen to what he says, rather than tell the ONA et al what to say.
Go on....tell me I'm wrong
TM

Ok you're wrong

Originally Posted by Gingermick

Ok you're wrong

Hey, smart**s, you might know highjacks, but I know highjinks! (and regularly practice)

Originally Posted by TermiMonster

Hey, smart**s,

I always thought being a smart**s was better than being a dumb**s.
However, you did ask someone to tell you that you were wrong, and I knew that the statement was rhetorical, however I couldn't resist.

Originally Posted by TEEJAY

By all accounts they made a complete botch of this case

Maybe, maybe not.

Unless I got my time line wrong he was detained at the airport before the evidence (incorrect it seems) about the sim card was found.

So I would suggest it went something like this;

UK terrorist act occurs (crashing jeep etc) and UK police find link to our man in OZ. Not the sim yet as that was found from memory later after our man was grabbed.

UK notify OZ who then put a pass alert for if he tries to leave the country and should (would?) have organised for a surveillence team to find and track him. Now to get a pass alert there must be some evidence/intell that he has done something and that is to the level of reasonable suspicion. (not belief as in court)

Low and behold he turns up at the airport with a one way ticket home while he has a job and visa here.

Based upon that it would seem there are reasonable grounds to suspect that he may be involved in some way in a terrorist act OS and to detain him to find out just what the hell is going on and the application of the anti terrorist laws were applied.

I would bet london to a brick that the preferred option would always have been surv/phones off/ build a case but the case was forced by his impended departure.

I doubt we will know the reasons he first came under the spotlight however I would suggest they are the reasons his visa was cancelled. he can now have this judicially reviewed in which case the govt will have to put up or shut up.

He was charged with an offence which was later dropped and he is a free (well home detention re visa cancellation ), if not confused and maybe cranky, doctor. I would suggest the system, though not perfect, appears to have worked in this case.

Originally Posted by dazzler

if not confused and maybe cranky, doctor. I would suggest the system, though not perfect, appears to have worked in this case.

How did you come to that conclusion Dazzler? The Doctor was released without charge but they (the government) couldn't wait to get him out of the country before the media could find out his side of the story. I get the feeling that you think it is OK for innocent people to be kicked out of this country at will - without justice. How many lives have you saved whilst you have been on this planet. Have you ever met this Doctor - No I didn't think so but you are prepared to make aspersion's from what you read. Well my cousin has worked with him and she has told me that he was a very well liked Doctor who will be sadly be missed by his collegues as well as his grateful patients.

This is just another con job / bungling / cover up / incompetent act by this joke of a government. Remember what happened to Cornelia Rau, Children Overboard, and Weapon’s of Mass Destruction? It makes this country’s credibility a joke in international circles.

Btw, Kevin Rudd should hang his head in shame. 99% of Australians had the intelligence and awareness to sift through Government propaganda and speak their hearts out (including the Greens leader Sen Bob Brown). He too probably knew there was nothing to incriminate Dr. Haneef. Yet Rudd didn’t have the guts to take a risk and condemn the Howard government. Grow a spine, before you aspire to be the Prime Minister of the best country in the World. If left to me he nor Howard will be Prime Minister after the next election. To think they (politicians) will have had a 14% rise in the past couples of years - s--t decisions = more money in the pocket.


MH

Hi MH

It has worked because a person who was suspected of involvement in a terrorist act was taken into custody, the case investigated, he was charged and then the matter reviewed and the charges dropped he was released. The laws were introduced for just this type of incident where the police need time to investigate a case against someone when there is a fear that to not do so may result in the deaths of many by a terrorist act. The guilt or innocence is not for the investigators to decide but whether there is a case to answer.

As for his visa cancellation, what I have suggested is that the evidence / intel that brought him to notice in the first place (pass alert at the airport) is the reason for his visa cancellation and this does not need to be to the level of belief but of suspicion. And by the way, if they wanted him out of the country they would not have detained him in the first place but cancelled his visa while he was away.

Finally three things;

1. I have saved three lives (got no idea how that is important but it seems to be some how )

2. No I have never met the dr and I am sure he is delightful, quietly spoken and polite. So is our dear friend Osama if you take the time to study his early interview . Nice people do bad things sometimes. Niceness does not prevent investigation.

3. I am not making aspersions on the dr's character, simply outlining how/why I think the matter progressed the way it did.

4. Cornelia was a stuff up by the immigration dept who had a culture that was disgraceful and treated anyone from OS with suspicion. The dept has been overhauled and the culture has definately changed. (Means nada here)

5. Kids overboard was a disgrace. (Ditto)

6. WMD was a disgrace. (Ditto)

7. Dont ya think the SMH or today tonight might just be able to find him when he arrives in India to report his story?

Perhaps you could explain how the matter should have been handled? Put a make believe investigators hat on and work from the point that there is sufficient intel/evidence for you to obtain a pass alert preventing our good doctors departure. (To get the pass alert as an investigator you need to prove the fact you have reasonable grounds to Customs )

Agent MH, were relying on you.

cheers

dazzler