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  1. #31
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    Nov 2012
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    Thornbury
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    great work - it isgood to see it coming together so well.


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  3. #32
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Riverina NSW
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    211

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    So, 12months and 6days later, the build continues

    I can't remember why I stopped, easily distracted I guess, but when I left the build in limbo there was a few things I wasn't too happy about that needed correcting. My main concern was the motor which was just too unsafe, most of the time turning the wrong way and I never allocated funds for a new motor, instead turning my attention towards other things. I started lining my shed earlier in the year and have finished half of it. About a week ago I ran out of gyprock and out of the blue wondered if that old motor on the bsaw could be reversed. Two main issues with doing this is that the motor was pretty cruddy inside. Once pulled apart I could imagine the crusty wires shorting on the casing if I tried to put it back together. Secondly, I realised I had no idea what I was doing so I left it in pieces and ordered a new 1hp motor off ebay. Should be here tomorrow I hope.

    I needed to get back into this build, study the instructions and kick on. What's evident is that my ideas on how to complete the bsaw varies a bit from Matthias' plans. As I get to the more finicky parts I'm finding that I don't have the ability to finish some parts the way he does nor as accurately, mainly due to not having a bsaw to cut some parts nor a router to accurately cut slots. As is suggested in the plans you can just get to the point of having the bsaw turning and whack on a temporary table to cut trunions and so forth but without a motor I ditched the plans and set about conjuring up ways to hobble up blade guides and a tilting table. I may revisit rebuilding these items but if they work as is they'll probably remain. Apart from dimensions the main difference to guides is that they're all roller bearing and the thrust bearing is aligned head on rather than sideways.

    To restart the project I decided to start off with something simple and built a stand on wheels. I started with Matthias' bsaw stand plans and modified them to incorporate some joinery I could do, like rebate joins, then started making things up, including making the stand taller. Too tall infact after wheels and a cross beam supports.

    Now, the updated cost.
    Subtotal $624+
    $12 Stand frame
    $25 Small panel of 12mm Marine ply
    $28 Stand wheels
    $17 4mm ply for stand and enclosure
    $15 Film face ply for table
    $18 brass hinges
    $20 bolts and screws etc
    =$759

    Some costs are a bit of a guess. eg, the film face ply is left over from shelving on the other side of the shed and the portion I've used is a guesstimate as a percentage of the full size piece previously bought. Other costs aren't included if they're repeats due to stuff ups. eg, I bought two more tyre tubes to replace the originals which were cut poorly and damaged. And of course there's still left overs of Tassie oak from the original purchase of timber a year ago which is being used for the lower frame support that goes on top of the stand and both blade guide assemblies.

    The first photo shows the bare frame for the stand made from 70x30mm pine plus you can make out the 65x30mm Tassie oak lower support frame that was glued and bolted to the bsaw base. The third pic from behind. The second and third photo also shows the 12mm marine ply base on the stand plus wheels attached, locking only on the front but I might put locking wheels on the back too.




    65x30mm was used on the upper blade guide and marine ply used for the clamp. Similar in function but very different to Matthias' dimensions. Seems to work fairly well so far though. Smaller parts made from Tassie Oak too. The guide is pretty crude but we'll see it handles abuse. I just didn't have the ability to accurately cut recesses and machine pretty pieces and I had to restart a couple of times when Tassie Oak guide holders split after a too heavy whack with mallet and chisel.




    I spent a lot of time lining up the table mount and even more time making the top of it flat and perpendicular to the blade. So not a lot of photos of rulers and squares. I planed the top down a few mm to get the surface right.


    Skip a few steps and here's the only real pic of the lower blade guide. Fairly rudimentary. You can also see the lower and upper table attached. As for the hinges, these are working well. Spent time here lining things up and I'm happy how it's turned out. The only thing I'd change here is the table mount should have been moved further to the left so the blade intersects the point where the hinges articulate. That may be done later, but doubt I'll bother. The table will turn 45deg but will need new zero clearance inserts for every angle cut other than 90deg. Hmm, sounds like it'll be a pain.


    Couldn't resist spinning it up by hand and doing a few cuts. Top table is 600x500mm, lower table is 600x300mm


    Alignment is pretty good. With the sideways alignment, the mount was dead on perpendicular but screwing the hinges pulled that side down a fraction. Simply the weight of my hand at the far left of the table makes it spot on perpendicular so some kind of hold down clasp will be required. Currently there is no way to clamp angle adjustment. I'm still working on ways to do this simply with a few ideas up my sleeve. Fore and aft alignment is perfect.



    And a glamour shot to finish. Must sweep tomorrow, unless the motor comes then I'll fit that first, otherwise I'll work on the enclosure, then sweep, maybe.

  4. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Deception Bay Qld
    Posts
    213

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    Good to see you back into it Mate, I have a lot of projects get left for a year or longer also.

  5. #34
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Riverina NSW
    Posts
    211

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    I'm notorius for it too and I wouldn't be surprised if this project gets put aside, or rather not quite finished and gets put into use. That happened last night to some extent. The good news is the motor arrived early yesterday morning and I spent most of the day mounting it. The bad news is my phone I used to record video and photos is out of action. It had a cracked screen and I tried to replace it last night before transferring photos. For some reason the new touch screen doesn't work so I can't type my password to access data.

    So anyway, the new 1hp arrived and I went and bought more bolts and new pulley. The pulley is a 4" one and by using a laser tacho and reflective tape I worked out some measurements.
    Motor runs at 1490rpm
    Bsaw wheels at 440rpm
    With a diameter of approx 40cm the speed of the wheels' circumference is 33km/hr
    Blade speed is approx 1800 feet/min

    I'm not sure if that's too slow or just right. The blade is 10mm, 6TPI which I bought as an all-rounder and it seems to work ok. I did find that my original mounting for the motor was stupid without any means to adjust belt tension. With some thicker cuts the belt would slip and the top wheel would slow down to 200 rpm. So I started making a metal mount from steel bar and angle. I'm only half way through this because once the proof of concept worked I got carried away with cutting and testing the capacity of the bsaw. Once the belt could be tightened the blade chewed through timber easily, though not super quick. The toughest cut would've been 190mm rip through Vic ash.

    For now, just need to make the motor mount more temporary and start building the enclosure. I've already pinched a few fingers between blade and wheels last year and more recently whilst hand turning the wheels. The powered blade looks much less forgiving.

    Cost update
    The motor was only $100, but $102 postage from Melbourne . I should've bought one when I was there in August. Since a motor locally was around the $250+ mark I'm going to add $202 to the build.
    sub $759
    motor $202
    bolts $12
    =$973

    Steel was ready on hand and I'm not adding a pulley since I bought two already for the old motor. I added at least one to the cost earlier. Just a shame shaft size was different.

  6. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Riverina NSW
    Posts
    211

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    Not much to add. Just that I borrowed my son's phone to take a couple of pics and videos. The photo shows the motor mounted on it's side with still a bit more to do to the mount. The motor was too tall to fit as delivered plus the lead outlet would've butted up against the bsaw frame. Luckily the mounting feet can be removed and bolted to either side and this current setup is problably the best. ID plate visible, black box easily accessible, cord facing upwards which will eventually go to an emergency stop button/on/off switch located directly higher on the frame.

    I bolted the motor to the base of the bsaw frame which led to an untensioned belt slipping when the saw was under load. Below shows the mount I'm working on now. The bolts through the bar into the motor housing purely hold the bar to the motor. The roughly cut slot in the facing section of bar that forms the 90deg angle has a coach screw clamping it in. That's all that's holding the motor to the saw and it's surprisngly solid and hasn't budged. There will be some angle welded to the two bars overhanging to the left, and some bar to act as a plate attached to the frame under the motor. A bolt or two will interact between the angle iron and plate to act as a tensioning mechanism. It'll make sense when it's done and hopefully will work well.



    Lastly a video showing startup and stop, ripping 190mm Vic ash, crosscut 65mm Vic ash, plus some thin ply my son did for a project. There's a clicking noise developed in the top main wheel which you can hear at times in the video. I tired to trouble shoot last night and just couldn't see why there's clicking but it's dawned on me now that it's spacing washers behind the top wheel. I don't think I mentioned that I retapped the axles for something more substantial then the small machine threads and screws which weren't holding that well. Now I've got 8mm threaded bolts with some different washers that I believe are out of alignment at the back of the top. It's impossible to see but I'm positive that's what it is.


  7. #36
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Albury Well Just Outside
    Posts
    13,315

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    Been a little while between post but great job on the build.

  8. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Riverina NSW
    Posts
    211

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    Thanks Christos. I never expected it to take this long but I gotta say that compared to some other projects around the house, not necessarily woodworking, but landscaping, work on cars or reno's, there hasn't been a deadline with this project which has made a world of difference regarding stress. But, since I started truly winging it during and after the wheel guides, I haven't revisited the plans and I find myself getting frustrated at times as I try and modify out of necessity or convenience. I get frustrated because I'm nearly having to do things twice or thinking I could do better next time, and of course there wont be a next time. Most parts I've thought I'll redo later are working well. For example the guides are fine, I'm yet to redo the motor mount because the one I experimented with is working fine. I dunno, when things are working I'm less likely to touch them unless they break. Whatever I've conjured in my mind's eye then experimented with has pretty much worked and I don't particularly want to pull things apart to make them prettier. I just need to take more time whilst on the tools, and be a bit more patient waiting for glue to dry. LOL.

    So today and yesterday I spent some 5hrs each day staring at the frame and wheels, wondering how I was going to cover it up and make the enclosure. Two things I wanted for the enclosure was to be able to put it on hinges which was different to the pop apart design Matthias did for this plan. Secondly, for ease of access and disassembly I wanted to have as few pieces as possible to make up the enclosure. Now I've never made a this kind of thing, the enclosure. Thin ply to make a box. I think Matthias used a box joint jig he made, I can't remember but the end products for his enclosures looks quite strong. And it looks like a similar feat should be easy, but no. For me, everything turned out a bit rough, but still workable. I used 6mm ply with strips of ripped Tassie oak supporting the corners, all glued together and an occasional screw. The top enclosure must have taken approx 10hrs yesterday with a lot of pondering in between as each piece was cut and added. Similar story today but I was showered before 7pm.

    One other thing I did yesterday was to cut a slot in the table to add a fence. No clamps yet, just using an F-clamp either end and there's a bit of freeplay. Once again, something cobbled up to see if it could work and I know I can improve it, but I'll wait till I break the first one.

    Front view of the enclosure in place. I cleaned all the dust off then ran a few 4x2 off cuts through to see where the dust fell. All the big stuff goes straight down and when the stand is finished, will be caught in a draw. Some fine dust did track around the blade though. Not the stuff stuck to the blade or tyres, but with the course of the blade partially closed now some of the dust casually follows this conduit and can be seen floating out of the gaps. I didn't plan on using a dust collection system in the shed but with the rear enclosure and other gaps to plug, I think dust collection will be on the list.


    The top enclosure has a continuous hinge recessed into it. The other side is locked by using a single magnet latch. Works well, no rattles, but has got a slight sag to it when unsupported. Could do with some reinforcement but not sure where yet.




    Here's both enclosures opened. I wanted to hinge the bottom but couldn't do it. Two magnets as above are used, one either side and the enclosure simply slides onto the frame.


    The fence and slot. Lots and lots of measuring, marking and checking. The main thing I wanted was to have the slot as square as possible. I reckon a second slot will go in aft the blade.


    I haven't finished the enclosure so far as everything since last year needs a coat of something, plus there's the rear of the enclosures to do. Not sure how many pieces to add but there'll be fixed and moveable pieces. Still working it out in my mind as to what's going to be the easiest way out to plug all the gaps so all the dust goes south.
    Last edited by Canoath; 19th November 2013 at 08:35 PM. Reason: Spelling

  9. #38
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Albury Well Just Outside
    Posts
    13,315

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    Thanks for the update. Yes I agree dust collection is needed for a bandsaw, and when I remember or between things to do I clean the dust that gets caught in the bandsaw.

    You are also not alone here as I also have to think about how to do something but that's the beauty of the internet, someone has either had the same or similar problem.

  10. #39
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    2,357

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    Great work. Very impressive what you have have achieved.

  11. #40
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    inverloch
    Posts
    472

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    Hi Canoath,

    I have been looking for a 1hp motor for a drill press but so far the cheapest I have come across is $168. Could you please tell me the brand and the company in Melbourne that you bought it from?

    Thanks in advance.

  12. #41
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Riverina NSW
    Posts
    211

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    Yeah safari it's Conon Motor in Glen Waverly. I don't think they have a website but do business either over the counter and ebay with pickup available. I was a bit hessitant to buy off ebay but I'm really happy with mine, packaging etc was excellent and instructions adequate to wire up and/or to reverse. They've got a pretty good range and I'll happily go back there. I've only read issues on their ebay feedback relating to pulleys. I bought my pulley local as there's two engineering places with alloy pulleys galore here. Quality seems really good, can't fault it really.
    Here's the listing for my motor.

    Electrical Motor Single Phase 240V 0 75KW 1HP 1400PM Shaft 19mm | eBay

    Thanks planemaker and christos. Yesterday and the day before I set about finishing the enclosure and enclosing the stand. I'm not sure whether I'll put draws in or what so not quite finished. Other than that I put the saw through it's paces to do a few experiments to catch dust in the base and to see what the saw will cut. Man that was fun. I got hooked finding really old pieces of timber I've kept for no particular reason and ripping them into planks. It's amazing to slice a crusty grey bit of timber to reveal the stunning appearance inside. My favourite piece was an old trapezium shaped piece of redgum that was presumably cut from a railway sleeper. I used to use two of these to put ramps on to help load a crusty low track car on a trailer a few years back. I don't know what happened to the other block but this one revealed an amazing colour and grain. From the outside it would seem the whole thing was rotten, except that it was heavy. I hand planed some areas and yeah, just stunning.

    The cuts are about 12 x 60cm and the 10mm 6TPI blade was a little stressed if I went too quick but no slipping nor did the motor slow down. I've got a couple more blades coming from carbatec that will be more suitable for ripping and resawing and may post results of those. Next though will be to sort out the stand and dust collection. Redgum dust is really fine and by fully enclosing the stand and punching a hole in the back for a hose from an old dyson, I was amazed how dramatically the dust was reduced. Beforehand it would track around and leak from crevices but a little suction from within caused most to stay inside and drop to the base. But the dyson has bugger all flow rate. More on that later when I sort out the dust issue but in the meantime, here's an example from part of the redgum piece, how it looked on the outside and what it looks like 10mm under the surface, plus a bit of planning on this one.


  13. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    inverloch
    Posts
    472

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    Thanks Canoath. You have certainly done a great job on the bandsaw so far.

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