Thread: Rotex or ras?

Considering the gear you already have at hand, the RAS 180 some course Saphir and Rubins. Then BS105 it, then ETS it. The RAS has sooo much grunt for that sort of heavy sanding (4mm deep grooves).

hi anthony, do you know if the dust collection on the ras 180 is as good as the other festool sanders?

Originally Posted by justinmcf

hi anthony, do you know if the dust collection on the ras 180 is as good as the other festool sanders?

Hi Justin - Considering how much material it can remove it does a fantastic job. But the user has something to contribute to dust extraction efficiency with the RAS. The user has to be aware which way the dust is being pushed by the rotary motion and adjust the guard (with brushes) to catch that dust and this pushes it towards the extraction port under the hood. This is not hard if you are watching what's going on, and you rotate the guard by twisting the side handle. Pretty simple. Compare this system using an angle grinder and you will be amazed at how well it works, but the ergonomic flexibility over an angle grinder (with some sort of dust hood) is much better. And compared to using an angle grinder with no dust hood... what a dusty nightmare that would be.

I am about to spend some more time with a RAS next week. I am doing my Jarrah veranda flooring and both the ROTEX and PLANEX had a hard time. And we know how good a job they can do. So when they don't do the trick, it's time to break out a RAS.

hi anthony, does the ras 180 come in a systainer, according to the festool website it comes in a carton, can you confirm this.

i look forward to hearing how you get on with your ras next week.
happy sanding!

cheers, justin.

Originally Posted by justinmcf

i look forward to hearing how you get on with your ras next week.

Me too. I was experimenting using the PLANEX as a timber sander and it was an interesting experience. I used Saphir 24 and some P40/60 Cristal, but more progress was made with finer Brilliant P80. Also different hardness pads made a big difference. I was even using the soft pad and two soft interface pads with the Brilliant P80 and got the best progress. That was all with the PLANEX and I thought it wasn't going that well until I tried the ROTEX. Knowing how well the ROTEX works on hard materials I realised that with the ROTEX having troubles the PLANEX was putting in a better effort than I gave it credit for.

But, time for the RAS which should do the trick on this hard flooring. Again I will get a chance to experiment with different abrasive and pads. It won't be a definitive test, but might help some.

Edit: RAS 180's are Systainerless.

i herd boat builders are using the planex,

for a floor i would not go past a polyvac (14in floor buffer).

doesnt fein sell an over size ROS that has a big motor.

Originally Posted by Gaza

i herd boat builders are using the planex,

for a floor i would not go past a polyvac (14in floor buffer).

doesnt fein sell an over size ROS that has a big motor.

Well to do floors properly, yes a proper floor sander sure would be the go. That's what the pro's should be using. I have not seen a Polyvac before. Looks better than using a drum sander.

Fein has some good large ROS. I am not a user of them so can't comment. But you would expect they would do a good job and be well built.

Me, I was using the PLANEX to see what it could do. I always wanted to try it as a floor sander and when the veranda floor needed a sand that was the time to experiment. It wasn't fussed by nail heads sticking up. I want to do a bit more experimenting with the PLANEX, maybe a table top next. But I know I will definately prep our workshop floor with the PLANEX when it comes time to re-oil.

Why dont you get a cheap electric hand plane to do most of the hardwork until your friend gets the planer attachment? Surely that would be faster than trying to sand out 4mm saw grooves?

hi kordes, we tried the electric planer, but the lines left by the planer still had to be grinded out, it was less dust using the planer, but more time was spent in labour.

right now we are working out how to make this quality furniture with the least amount of labour. the planer attachment for the mill is the way to go for sure,
thought i would ask on the forum to get different ideas.

i have learnt i great deal asking questions here, a week ago i didnt have a clue about the rotex or ras. i also need a grinding type tool to grind corners and natural edges, i think the ras 180 is looking good so far.

now i know a great deal about these tools thanks to everybody helping out.

cheers guys, justin.

Quick question Juntin: Are you after a fine furniture finish, or rustic look?

hi nt900, good question, i am looking for the rustic look but i would consider it a fine finish too.

we have made bookshelves, computer desks, coffee tables, bar tops, restaurant tables and seats/ benches.
some of the shelves for the bookcases are different thickness, e.g. bottom 3 shelves are 38 mm thick and the top 3 shelves are between 30 -32mm thick. the sides are 35mm thick.

we havent had any complaints yet, all the customers love the rustic look, but because i am using the festool sanders to finish, we get a beautiful finish once we coat it twice with intergrain-dimension 4, and then we coat it twice with intergrain-floortec. (we sand in between each coat with 320 grit).
this finish makes it weather proof and very hardwearing/durable. a lot of the tables and chairs we make for restaurants are permanently outside.

we stick to 3 or 4 types of wood. mainly silky oak, forest red gum, tallowwood and cedar when we can find it!

i have tried to upload photos on this site, because we would like to sell more, lots more! but it is a work in progress. i have set my camera to small basic photos, but this is still too big to upload here. i think i need to download software.

can any one confirm this is correct, or could you please explain the correct procedure to upload photos?

thanks, justin.

Originally Posted by justinmcf

i make slab furniture, my mate mills the timber with a lucas mill, and i turn it into rustic slab furniture.

there is a lot of saw blade marks on the slabs which i have to remove, they are 1mm-4mm deep grooves.

we use 5 and 6 inch grinders to remove these marks now, but the dust is unbelievable!
i then use the festool 105mm belt sander with 80 grit and 100 grit to remove all marks left by the grinders.
next i use a festool ets 150/5 to finish with 120 grit, 240 grit and 320 grit.

which product would you recommend for fast removal of rough material.
rotex 150 or ras 180?

p.s. my mate is considering buying the planer attachment for the lucas mill, but in the meantime i have to do it the hard way. lots of sweat and elbow grease!

Originally Posted by justinmcf

we tried the electric planer, but the lines left by the planer still had to be grinded out, it was less dust using the planer, but more time was spent in labour.

right now we are working out how to make this quality furniture with the least amount of labour. the planer attachment for the mill is the way to go for sure,
thought i would ask on the forum to get different ideas.

i have learnt i great deal asking questions here, a week ago i didnt have a clue about the rotex or ras. i also need a grinding type tool to grind corners and natural edges, i think the ras 180 is looking good so far.

Originally Posted by justinmcf

good question, i am looking for the rustic look but i would consider it a fine finish too.

we have made bookshelves, computer desks, coffee tables, bar tops, restaurant tables and seats/ benches.
some of the shelves for the bookcases are different thickness, e.g. bottom 3 shelves are 38 mm thick and the top 3 shelves are between 30 -32mm thick. the sides are 35mm thick.

we havent had any complaints yet, all the customers love the rustic look, but because i am using the festool sanders to finish, we get a beautiful finish once we coat it twice with intergrain-dimension 4, and then we coat it twice with intergrain-floortec. (we sand in between each coat with 320 grit).
this finish makes it weather proof and very hardwearing/durable. a lot of the tables and chairs we make for restaurants are permanently outside.

justin, I know this is the Festool forum, but have you considered either a wood wiz or slabmaster ?

how flat and even in thickness do you want the slabs — maybe, if you're after "least amount of labour" you should invest in a 20" planner and wide belt sander

or stay with the angle grinders (maybe jump up to 9" grinders), but do the grinding and belt sanding in a high volume dust extraction booth

I have difficulty understanding how an electric planer followed by the belt sander would be slower than using an angle grinder followed by the same belt sander


ian

hi ian, the timber thickness of the furniture is not consistent, timber is not dead straight, slightly bowed here and there, so i guess it cant be classed as fine furniture, we are using the last of my mates stacked timber, which was not stacked very well in the first place.

soon we will be cutting up fresh timber and then we will build a storage shed to dry it out. i am guessing we cant use this timber straight away for furniture making. if any body knows more about this drying period, please feel free to let me know.
at the moment, we are working on acreage, basically where the logs are cut and delivered to us. we use a big honda generator for electricity.

i would love to buy a decent thicknesser, (the dewalt dw 735 just cant handle the massive slabs we are feeding through it), wide drum sander, proper cyclone dust extraction, and this site has been fantastic for gathering information on these topics.

we have only started this business, i normally work in construction, but it is really quiet and i find there is a market for this type of furniture.

so we are buying hand tools for now, and then upgrade to the planer attachment for the mill. unfortunately this all costs money, so at the minute we are taking baby steps, hence all the questions about different sanders.

the electric hand plane was the first thing i tried, my mate was beside me grinding a slab and i tried planing a slab, he won, it was heaps faster with a sanding disc attached to the grinder. btw, we tried a 9 inch grinder, but you dont have control over that beast, it does what it wants, not what i want it to do.

i reckon a year from now, we will have a nice cosy little commercial unit, working in the shade must be a grand thing!
then i will be back here looking more advice on the big boys toys. for now, we are doing it the hard way, but i love every minute of it, its great fun seeing dirty old slabs that have been sitting for years getting turned into something useful and beautiful.

cheers, justin.

Originally Posted by justinmcf

hi ian, the timber thickness of the furniture is not consistent, timber is not dead straight, slightly bowed here and there, so i guess it cant be classed as fine furniture, we are using the last of my mates stacked timber, which was not stacked very well in the first place.

soon we will be cutting up fresh timber and then we will build a storage shed to dry it out. i am guessing we cant use this timber straight away for furniture making. if any body knows more about this drying period, please feel free to let me know.

the usual rule of thumb for air drying is 1 year for every 25mm of thickness
so a 50mm slab would take 2 years

also you really should seal the ends

at the moment, we are working on acreage, basically where the logs are cut and delivered to us. we use a big honda generator for electricity.

rather than work in the dust, get yourself some big pedestal vans to blow a stream of air across your work site with the intent of distributing the dust beyond where you work

we have only started this business, i normally work in construction, but it is really quiet and i find there is a market for this type of furniture.

so we are buying hand tools for now, and then upgrade to the planer attachment for the mill. unfortunately this all costs money, so at the minute we are taking baby steps, hence all the questions about different sanders.

fair enough



ian