Thread: Brown & Sharpe #2 grinder restoration

Originally Posted by Abratool

Greg
Viewed your photos this morning, & immediately thought about keepng the "Patina" on old machines as discussed with BT Bob many times on this Forum.
However, accepted, that your Brown & Sharpe Surface Grinder is way beyond hanging on to any Patina.
I have heard these Brown & Sharpe Grinders in operation (Shows my age) & they have a very pleasant musical sound as the mechanical trippers on the table are in operation.
It will be wonderful to follow the restoration process as the machine develops.
All the best.
Bruce

Thanks Bruce. I have never purchased a machine with an acceptable paint job ever. The Deckel was almost as bad as the grinder, and the lathe was just...goofy. My wood bandsaw was about the same. I got a diamond grinder on gumtree that had been painted with a mop so that too will need a minor tart-up. Funny thing is I hate painting with a passion.

Greg

Originally Posted by Greg Q

So, the Dulux part of the process taken care of,

Greg, did you forget to post pics?

Some progress about week three...

I am sorry about the sideways images...I am posting by ipad and the forum software insists on rotating it.

The contrasting colour is silver hammertone from a spray can...HiChem brand, which seems to last longer than most brands, and dries rapidly.

The sharp eyed will note the castors under the grinder...they are just for shop convenience during the overhaul stage. I find the pallet jack is too cumbersome for any fancy moves in a crowded garage.

Hi GQ,

It will work better if you set it up this way. up..


237582d1350626598-brown-sharpe-2-grinder-restoration-image.jpg

That grinder is certainly looking the good nice work..

I just got back from Carrum Downs ( via Stuart's marvellous shed).. Now to clean up that laser...

Regards
Ray

Originally Posted by RayG

Hi GQ,


I just got back from Carrum Downs ( via Stuart's marvellous shed).. Now to clean up that laser...

Regards
Ray

That laser is going to be sweet as, bro. I couldn't get over how thoroughly that ancient foam was trying to return to its crude oil origins.

Here's another few shots of the grinder: the motor compartment with the motor on new rubber pads. I use engine block enamel in white for insides of castings just to completely anal about it. Plus I'll be using those lower compartments for tool storage in future.

The other shot is of the untouched last few pieces of the casting yet to be cleaned and painted, and a look into what Brown and Sharpe calls the oil tank...the area that catches all the drips and dust. Of course that's where the feed mechanisms live, so there's some repair work ahead of us there too.

Originally Posted by Greg Q

That laser is going to be sweet as, bro. I couldn't get over how thoroughly that ancient foam was trying to return to its crude oil origins.

The Laser Brea tar pits... gently dabbing metho and lots of paper towells seems to be working, I feel like an artwork conservator.. Good news is it powers up, and the laser appears to be working.. documentation is the usual high end standard for HP gear, full service manual circuit diagrams, and fault finding charts, test and calibration records... I was a bit dubious when I saw all the black crap, but underneath... it's a gem! Don't reply here I'll start a new thread..

Originally Posted by Greg Q

Here's another few shots of the grinder: the motor compartment with the motor on new rubber pads. I use engine block enamel in white for insides of castings just to completely anal about it. Plus I'll be using those lower compartments for tool storage in future.

Wow, what a difference to the original condition.. I think cleaning up and re-wiring are an essential part of a machine rebuild such as this, I've found the older wiring insulation sometimes just crumbles into dust and you are left with lethal bare copper.. Are you going VFD?

Regards
Ray

Originally Posted by RayG

The Laser Brea tar pits... gently dabbing metho and lots of paper towells seems to be working, I feel like an artwork conservator.. Good news is it powers up, and the laser appears to be working.. documentation is the usual high end standard for HP gear, full service manual circuit diagrams, and fault finding charts, test and calibration records... I was a bit dubious when I saw all the black crap, but underneath... it's a gem! Don't reply here I'll start a new thread..



Wow, what a difference to the original condition.. I think cleaning up and re-wiring are an essential part of a machine rebuild such as this, I've found the older wiring insulation sometimes just crumbles into dust and you are left with lethal bare copper.. Are you going VFD?

Regards
Ray

Yes, I bought a Danfoss VLT last week. Stupidly I didn't chase the other two they had a bit harder.

Some notes: Anorak Bob mentioned the little laser exchange that Ray G and I had. It pertained to a laser survey system that Ray bought at auction. I was with Stustoys at the inspection and was astonished that all the foam nests for the coonents made circa 1972 had reverted to crude oil, hence my comments to Ray.

Today I cleaned and painted the three reamining components: the top of the machine's main casting, the saddle, and the work table. I also cleaned, degreased and painted the " oil tank" which houses the longitudinal and lateral feed screws. I am very glad to see the end of cleaning and painting.

Pictured here is the basic machine casting with cap bolted in place. I had to counterbore for a 1/4-20 capscrew which I had in stock to replace a long gone machine screw. There are quite a few missing fasteners on this machine. Mike has already made four cheesehead screws from 5/16 UNF bolts. I reckon we need to do about five more to populate all the vacant threaded bores on this thing.

Also pictured is the counterweight arm pulley which Phil Machtool kindly turned for me one evening after an an already long day in the salt mines. It had been abraded in some random shape which was no match for the big Nardini and a carbide tool (the piece would not fit on Mike's Rivett). The pulley as found was a two-ratio sheave in cast iron with a bronze bore liner. Both it and the shaft it rode in on were scored a treat. I asked Phil to counterbore both sides of the pulley to accept aome 2RS bearings that I had on the shelf because I wanted a back end of the machine that did not need regular oiling/watering/assuring that its ass did not look too big in that dress.

*the shaft, and the bronze bore liner in the pulley were rooted by the action of grinding dust and a plugged oil port. Hence the attraction of low maintenance sealed bearings at commodity prices.

The pulley was trued and bored, and its mating shaft is being turned down as I write over at Mike's place. I expect that the spindle drive components of the machine should all be mounted by close of business tomorrow, which leaves only the he-man stuff of survey and correction of the ways. Oh yeah, and hard chroming and re-grinding of the spindle. This grinder is proving my theory that a worn-out machine is too expensive even if it is free.

Hi GQ,

What are you doing for the drive belt? I'm interested in the details of how you are going to do the cylindrical grinding on the spindle, I'm going to have to do something similar on the mill one of these days.

Regards
Ray

Hi Ray...

I am going to re-use the belt that was in place. One I de-gunked all of the coolant + oil + grit it revealed itself to be in good nick with no hard spots. Green backed composite.

Tday I am wondering why I bother as there are two nice grinders on Gray's right now for under $400, ending tomorrow.

Yestrday I was musing that a bloke could CNC this thing without a world of trouble if he was so inclined.

Senor Garwood bought a 650mm ballscrew from China, custom machined features on each end for $109 couriered to his door. I was impressed.

Greg

Excellent work Greg, while I disapprove of the colour scheme the painting quality looks good...

Are you scraping the ways at all? Or getting the long ways ground and scrape the short ways to suit?

You are right about the work to rebuild something from scratch... To do it properly is a lot of work..

Wait til you get a load of the large pink polka-dot stickers that will be the crowning touch, RC

The ways on this thing are a mixed bag: the lateral ways (cross feed, if you will) will need about 6 thou taper scraped out. It is going to be a chore and a half. The longitudinal ways which of course see most of the wear are totally rooted. The vee and flat ways are so worn in fact that they are no longer making contact...rather, the flat tops of the vee way are now lapping themselves into the table, and the flat ways have worn right down to the parent casting!

Oddly. Queerly even, the quick survey I did showed no discernible variation in height over the travel. The random number generator came up "zero" this time.

The repair scheme right now is either to bond some phosphor bronze to the table and scrape it in, or use turcite. Phil reckons that a hobby machine of this light weight would do well with Turcite. There are no way wipers, but they could be retro-fitted. A vacuum and/or coolant would go a long way to preventing 90% of the wear that you'd otherwise expect, as you know.

Right now I am contemplating making a spotting tool per MTR for the vertical ways...I could get that made in the morning and get to levelling the machine for a serious geometrical survey.

Since we have gone this far there's no point in not going the whole hog. There's only time to be spent on it at this stage. Well, that the chroming & grinding of the spindle. And the electrics, but I probably have most of that in stock already care of ebay rainy day purchases.

Greg

Mike G from Adelaide sent me four 3/8" button oilers which he sourced from a US supplier whose name cannot be mentioned. These will replace the three missing/broken ones from the table. The Brown & Sharpe folks thought that it would be OK to have a slightly uphill run from the rear oilers to the oil wells which supply the rollers that spread the goodness between the ways. Of course, being perished, the rear wells were dry, and the rear way is comprehensively, completely stuffed.

Today was a shop day...making storage cabinets for my surface plate stand and a new base for my bandsaw. I had the reverse Midas touch this morning, so I'm not sure if I made any progress or not. Lots of firewood, and lots of mess.

Mike G, my local mate, returned one of the three idler pulleys that I had asked him to revisit on the lathe. Turns out it had been sleeved in the past, a little egg shaped, and 0.06mm undersized. I was wondering why the bearings weren't happy once the assy had cooled. All good now

Greg

The only progress made this week was today. Several years ago I was given this cat iron sliding table from an old Felder woodworking machine. It was a bad design as it had fairly small ball bearings running on cast ways. They brinelled easily, ruining the part.

For my purposes it should be good. I needed a tool 175mm wide and 680mm long. As luck would have it this allowed me to remove the two thick sides and save them for other tools. (Straightedges, gib strips).

I used three 1.2 mm abrasive wheels to do this job. The tool is 8mm thick and is a manageable weight. Now I have to clean it up, relieve the centre section and scrape it flat. It should be stable enough for what I hope will be a single day's use.