Thread: Buying a lathe

Lathes with the same or broadly similar features are available from local sellers, either Hare and Forbes or eBay. They are all made in China at that price point. I think you have to spend more than $10K to get a Taiwanese made machine of similar specs. A European machine of the same envelope would be unaffordable if you could get one.

So...there are various groups on Yahoo for owners of Chinese made lathes. There are many well documented fixes for their shortcomings. I don't know anything about gunsmithing. Do you need accurate work holding? Are you going to have to cut a range of threads including some very fine threads? Are you going to be working in harder, less machine friendly steels? are you going to be working on small diameter pieces, and do you plan on using carbide insert tooling?

I ask these questions (and many, many more;-)) because the lathe you ref'd has no collets included. (Collets that allow workpieces to mounted through the spindle would be an advantage, especially in the 5C size.) The chucks supplied will be...well, put it this way: two good chucks new would cost more than that entire lathe.

It has a QC toolpost with one holder, which kinda defeats the whole idea. It also appears to be the 'button type of holder, not nearly as nice or rigid as a wedge type.

The range of speeds is too low for carbide tooling on small dia. parts

It has a single phase motor, not optimum if surface finish is important.

It doesn't say if it cuts every thread in its stated range which may or may not be significant.

I expect that others with direct experience with Chinese machines will weigh in-I hope so at any rate. My observations are based only on the spec sheet-no direct experience. What I do have direct experience in is buying older high spec machines. That path too has pitfalls: dealers with inflated expectations of value, wear and tear that takes months to fix, missing and often unavailable parts, bizarre and arcane restoration tools and procedures, industrial mass, industrial power requirements. But its fun, and the only way to get an affordable very high quality machine tool short of spending very high quality money*.

*I have a friend that just spent, and I kid you not, $50K to upgrade to a better lathe of about the same size as that Grizzly.

Good luck.

Greg

Greg

Boy. Well if you want my opinion you couldn't buy a worse machine for gunsmithing.

Have you actually done much gunsmithing ? Most of it is handwork. I suppose you could turn a barrel but they are often forged, including and especially the rifling.

If it's specifically for making small arms you don't need that much capacity but you do need a very precise machine. The asian machines are pretty ordinary. I know that will offend some here but I can show you in no uncertain terms how and why they fall down.

If I was in your position and had room for a machine that size I'd keep an eye on ebay and pick up an old colchester student or master. A mk1 student went in melbourne a few weeks back for $1800. 12" swing, infinitely better machine than that thing. I know the dealers ask $6k and up for them but it doesn't mean you have to pay that. Have a look on ebay.co.uk at the dean smith and grace machines. These are the rolls royce of lathes and they literally give them away over there. It'll cost you about $2k to bring one into aus. 13" X 30" is their smallest machine. Sexier than Sofia Loren...

You MIGHT get by with a long bed hercus assuming you can find one, but they aren't as stiff as I'd want for guns. A hercus 260 is a tad bigger than the more common 9" and about $1500 as opposed to the $950 you pay for a 9". A normal 9" and 260 has a 2' bed which is a bit short.

Whatever you get get a good set of collets. They are cheap as chips these days and you'll have a slightly better chance at accuracy.

If it were me I'd be building a forge and getting some good quality files....

2c

If I had the hobby money to spare, This is the machine that I would get for that sort of work. It didn't sell, so the vendoe may negotiate.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA:IT&ih=020

That link appears to have disappeared Fossil.

CVA, very nice, but much dearer.

As I say you could probably land a DS&G for about $4k. Doesn't have the bells and whistles of that machine but rigidity and precision is no problem!

Possibly a philosophical point. I've never, for example, liked chipmasters. Electronically variable drive and that chunky rigid bed, but they are a pain to clean and I find I can get the speeds I want from an old fashioned gearbox. Never could get used to twiddling the dial. I'd have a student any day.

Then again I quite like bridgeports too so I must be a heathen...

Put this number into ebay search:

300230976717

That link still works for me...a CVA MkI in Mt Martha Victoria. The seller's starting bid was $6K. I think that's good value* considering the stuff included.

High quality lathes that I have seen for sale in the past year:

CVA
Monarch (but not the 10EE)
Schaublin 125
Casaneuve
Hembrug
Weiler
Colchester (I think)
DSG as Damian mentioned
Takisawa
Hardinge.

The problem with toolroom quality machines like this is that they would have been the best machines in whichever shop they were installed. As such, they would have been the 'go-to' machines, and would have seen the most use and most wear.

Machine restoration is a kind of a hobby too, but obviously not for most people. I don't know where you'd go for an affordable new machine that wouldn't be a disappointment.

*Compared to the proper equipping of a new or bare machine. It is possible to spend big big money on "stuff".

Originally Posted by gregoryq

That link still works for me...a CVA MkI in Mt Martha Victoria.

This is what I get.

Found it through the number damian listed above.

Where did you see a dsg for sale ?

The only ones I've seen are in the uk, where, frustratingly, they seem to be common and cheap. I've nott seen one for sale lately in aus. If I missed one I'd like to know more... How much ? where ? etc...

Where did you see a dsg for sale ?

The only ones I've seen are in the uk, where, frustratingly, they seem to be common and cheap. I've nott seen one for sale lately in aus. If I missed one I'd like to know more... How much ? where ? etc...

OK.... here is a copy of the ebay ad from the seller.
Please take note: I do not have any affiliation with the seller. I just like the look of the lathe. As I said before, If I had money to throw around on such purchases.... this would be the style of lathe It would be looking at.

Regrettably I have for sale my home workshop equipment (see my milling machine listed seperately). This lathe is a model 1A series 3, which was manufactured in England in the 1950's. At that time it was sold for approximately 25,000 pounds. I don't know how best to describe this machine, other than it is the best lathe I have ever used, and is extremely accurate. It has not had a hard life, to my knowledge it has been used as a home workshop machine for the last 20 years at least. The following website contains all the technical information on this machine http://www.lathes.co.uk/cva/index.html
The entire machine is one piece cast iron (no stand) and is very heavy. It doesn't need anchoring to the floor, and in fact has no provision for doing so. It has approximately 30" between centres and a 12" throw. It comes with 3 jaw, 4 jaw and faceplate, plus numerous supports and tools. It also has a quick release tool holder. This machine, together with the milling machine I am selling seperately, would be ideal for a small machine shop or serious home workshop. Please don't mistake this lathe for one of the various chinese machines available today, they are chalk and cheese.
This is a 3 phase machine and is very heavy. You will need to factor in the cost of moving by a professional mover. Please feel free to call me with any questions. David 0409 603 749. I have a very genuine reason for selling.

The DSG that Damian asks about was in the Trading Post last year. In Dandenong. I was thinking about it but it was a (I think) 60" BC machine...about four tonnes of nice* that I couldn't rig into my garage. On the other hand I needed a crane truck anyway for my Hembrug, but I can use a pallet jack on it which would have been impossible for the DSG. (Also, didn't feel like rewiring for the 25 hp motor, and I wanted to leave some room for a someday mill).

*nice in the context that it is British. I guess oil leaks are appropriate on a lathe

Cheers

Greg

ROFLOL Hysterical.

I don't know how keen I'd be for one that big, but the short bed 15" or a 13X30 is a convenient size.

25 hp. Wouldn't you enjoy watching the street lights dim every time you started it up ?

I should also mention I've never used a CVA so i suppose I shouldn't comment on them, but they are a type of lathe that just doesn't float my boat. I remember using a swiss mill years ago - cna't remember the name. Beautiful thing, 1 motor for everything and ran like a clock, but if anyone asked me to overhaul one I'm sure I'd have a breakdown. Utterly bizarre. I guess I just like conventional, but well built, stuff.

Hi there fossil,I looked at that lathe myself,Its a beuty.he also had a nice mill too.

Fossil that lathe sold for $6k

Looks like the lathes they had at School back in the 60's

Fossil that lathe sold for $6k

Hmmmm. I have it saved in my ebay watched list and it has it as ended auction with 0 bidders?????