Thread: gloves for metalworking?

Originally Posted by Pete F

Agree, I sometimes wear gloves, sometimes not, depending on what I'm doing. Unlike some, I typically DO wear them when at the bench grinders. I'm genuinely interested in how a grinding wheel can draw a gloved hand in, on the other hand (excuse the pun) they do protect from the heat and have often saved smaller cuts etc when the material has been sharp. Of course I always wear gloves when welding, indeed have a special pair I reserve just for the purpose so as not to contaminate the TIG with oil and so on.

Dean instead of thick gloves, and I have to agree with others, they are dangerous around a lathe, have you considered the blue nitrile gloves? KBS Intouch Blue Glove

I use these quite a lot, indeed tonight as a matter of fact, especially if I'm doing really dirty work or handling solvents, also when painting or powder coating so I don't contaminate the work after degreasing. They're not quite as natural as bare hands, but pretty darn good just the same. The beauty if not having to scrub with hand cleaner when finished. Instead just peel them off and away you go. Because I'm such a tight-wad I turn then back out the correct way and keep using one pair until they break or leak, so a box seems to last forever, however though they're not expensive. I think they would protect your hands well without the safety concerns.

Pete

Hi all, this is my first post so please be nice. Im a high school teacher and we use the blue nitrile gloves for finishing work only, welding gloves for welding and no gloves around machinery. As a school we are constantly dealing with the lowest common denominator( children) and try to provide every possible way to keep them safe.

Gloves have their place in the shed. I tend to forget to wear them until I burn myself and then curse and put them on! Those blue nitrile gloves are a good idea. Saves having filthy hands. Nothing worse than going to a friends place and eating at the table with permanent in ground black dirt in your finger nails that won't come out no matter how much you scrub.

I always wondered about the theory with steel capped boots. I have heard people say that they can cause you to loose your toes if something falls on your shoes because the steel cap acts like a guillotine?

Surely if the object is heavy enough to force your steel cap to do that then it would be heavy enough to crush your toes (without steel caps) anyway?

Cheers,

Simon

I have also heard the theory. If you had your foot run over by a forklift wearing normal boots you would maybe get broken bones but still have a foot. It is possible for just the toe area to be run over and only cause bruising. If wearing steel caps as the rumour says you loose all your toes. I do not endorse this theory. I don't know myself.

My issue is with fit inside steel caps causing long term foot pain, rubbing etc. Boot makers do not understand foot sizes. My foot is an 8 E(I think). Tell that to anyone selling boots and you get a blank look. Go to a decent shoe shop and they understand.

Dean

Originally Posted by Dave J

For anything else like welding and grinding etc I don't wear gloves.

Dave

Even if you don't wear gloves anywhere else I'd urge you to wear them when welding. Quite apart from the risk of direct burns, the damage due UV radiation from the arc is very real. I recall the very first time I bought a small TIG welder and thought I'd "just try it out". Of course I used a welding helmet, but otherwise an open T shirt and no gloves. The "sunburn" I received from that relatively short exposure was, quite literally, unbelievable. I don't burn easily, but any exposed skin was like a lobster! It was a lesson learnt. The temptation to not wear gloves when TIG welding is especially strong, since gloves make feeding the filler rod considerably more difficult, but I can honestly say I have never seen a professional welder working without them, and for good reason.

Pete

I was caught that way, Pete, much worse than sunburn, but I'm much wiser now.

Mythbusters did one on steel caps, they've got to be almost as good as wikki surely?

http://tubeplus.me/player/1168348/MythBusters/season_3/episode_23/Steel_Toe_Amputation/%22

I think they found one guy that had lost a toe to a steel cap.

I'm far more likely to drop a chuck on my foot than have it run over by a forklift.

Stuart

Originally Posted by Oldneweng

I have also heard the theory. If you had your foot run over by a forklift wearing normal boots you would maybe get broken bones but still have a foot. It is possible for just the toe area to be run over and only cause bruising. If wearing steel caps as the rumour says you loose all your toes. I do not endorse this theory. I don't know myself.

This situation is just like seat belts. There are cases of people dying because of seat belts but overall they save lives and reduce serious injury. My dad was in a logging truck when it hit a fallen tree and his side of the cabin was crushed almost to nothing. Luckily he had no seatbelt on and went headfirst thru the windscreen, still holding onto his seat, and hit a tree. Luckily he was wearing his hardhat but in the process broke a leg tore kneecap off and fracture 3 vertebrae but he lived.

Steel caps suffer a similar issue to forklifts when using a chainsaw. If the chain comes down on the front edge of the cap it skates off the boot but if it comes down towards the back of the cap it can skate off the back and take the whole foot off. Nevertheless I still wear steel caps when using a chain saw because the biggest accident risk is not from the saw but dropping a lump of wood on my foot. For chainsaw users there is also a fix in the wearing of thick socks made of chap like material - I have a pair of these but they are very hot.

Getting slightly OT i know but it's still interesting....

I had a conversation with a person who said that air bags (SRS airbags in cars) were nothing but bad news. They only cause more injuries he said. He quoted me some stats that said that since air bags have been available in cars, injury rates due to motor vehicle accidents had gone up.....

I agreed with him and said that is because all those extra people that had incurred injuries would typically be dead without the air bags. No injuries though!

Simon

Originally Posted by barney2804

Hi all, this is my first post so please be nice. Im a high school teacher and we use the blue nitrile gloves for finishing work only, welding gloves for welding and no gloves around machinery. As a school we are constantly dealing with the lowest common denominator( children) and try to provide every possible way to keep them safe.

Welcome and good to have you on board (pun intended) LOL
We have a few teachers here.

Dave

Originally Posted by simonl

Getting slightly OT i know but it's still interesting....

I had a conversation with a person who said that air bags (SRS airbags in cars) were nothing but bad news. They only cause more injuries he said. He quoted me some stats that said that since air bags have been available in cars, injury rates due to motor vehicle accidents had gone up.....

I agreed with him and said that is because all those extra people that had incurred injuries would typically be dead without the air bags. No injuries though!

Simon

The seatbelt analogy was precisely the one I was going to use however I forgot to mention it in my post (one of my keyboards just packed it in so I was playing musical computers). I agree entirely with the airbag example too. My best mate used to own a wrecking yard, many years ago now. There was something about the cracked windscreens complete with hair still stuck in the glass from the donor's head that I found especially gross.

Pete

Originally Posted by BobL

This situation is just like seat belts. There are cases of people dying because of seat belts but overall they save lives and reduce serious injury. My dad was in a logging truck when it hit a fallen tree and his side of the cabin was crushed almost to nothing. Luckily he had no seatbelt on and went headfirst thru the windscreen, still holding onto his seat, and hit a tree. Luckily he was wearing his hardhat but in the process broke a leg tore kneecap off and fracture 3 vertebrae but he lived.

Steel caps suffer a similar issue to forklifts when using a chainsaw. If the chain comes down on the front edge of the cap it skates off the boot but if it comes down towards the back of the cap it can skate off the back and take the whole foot off. Nevertheless I still wear steel caps when using a chain saw because the biggest accident risk is not from the saw but dropping a lump of wood on my foot. For chainsaw users there is also a fix in the wearing of thick socks made of chap like material - I have a pair of these but they are very hot.

I would disagree with the statement regarding seatbelts. I wear seatbelts all the time because I agree that they save lives except in exceptional cases. I don't understand how you can compare the wearing of steel cap boots in an industry that has virtually no risks from foot injury, with the wearing of seatbelts.

I am not aware of any possible incident in a winery where steel capped boots would be a benefit to the wearer, in my position. Other positions, maintenance etc I do not include. Barrel work is a possible, but I rarely get to do that. Remember that for 9 months I spend 8 hours a day walking on concrete and for the remaining 3 months this is increased to 12 hours a day 6 days a week and I have trouble finding boots to fit. The ones I have are a compromise at best. Safety at work is usually decided by people sitting in the office. Do you want them deciding your safety?

I just spent about 6 months chasing up a pair of boots that fits because the ones I had been wearing were too expensive for work to pay for. In my job if we get 6 months out of a pair of boots we are doing well. Constantly wet and covered in cleaning chems etc. I wont go into detail but the boss finally said forget it, we will pay the extra. If I could get boots that fit properly I would happily wear them but as said before, boot makers have no idea beyond basic sizes. They think it is a good thing to supply half sizes. They cater for average people and no body else. My Podiatrist agrees with my thinking.

Wearing a seatbelt does not cause any issues at all. No pain! No extra stress to the body! Not enough rubbing to cause a problem! No spine twisting from poor design! No squashed toes from lack of space. (That is BLOODY Painful)! No posture problems! How can the two be compared? Poorly designed and fitted steel capped boots can cause major posture and spine problems, seatbelts cannot.

Hard hats are similar. If you are at risk of injury from falling objects wear them by all means. If not? My neck tells me that I have suffered more injury from wearing a hard hat in the last 12 years than I can count. They reduce your overhead vision and cause you to hit your head on objects above your head constantly. If I did not wear them I would be able to see these objects and avoid them. I almost never hit my head when not at work and I am regularly in similar situations. It happens daily at work due to badly designed installations and maintenance personel who don't ask the people who are using the stuff they are installing.

Safety is based on obvious injuries. If you can prevent a few serious injuries it is easy to ignore minor ones. My issue is that work places invoke safety rules even if they are not going to help. They are being seen to be fixing safety issues. They are being proactive. Most people think they are doing a great job even if they are causing more injuries from their policies than before.

Timber Mills have policies that safety glasses should be worn at all time when on site. This came from a St Johns ambulance officer who was doing a first aid refresher course for work. The purpose is to protect your eyes from sawdust blowing about (between car park and office). I pointed out that this does not work to the officer and she immediately realised that she had fallen into the trap of accepting another persons point of view without questioning its validity herself.

They are being proactive. If you look at safety glasses and their uses you will see that they are designed to protect your eyes from impact damage, not dust in the wind. This is just a fairy tale. If they want to provide safety from air borne sawdust they should reduce the dust levels but this is too expensive.

I used to live next to a timber mill. If I came out of my shed with glasses on and sawdust was blowing around, I took them off. I used to have EPA monitors etc in my back yard. I know the problems.

I am saying that safety should be related to the issues at hand, not rules made up by people who have no idea. If I think something will provide me with better safety I will use it. Think about the real truth behind what you are doing, safety wise, use your own judgement to determine if it is really safer that way and take your personal safety into your own hands, not the hands of someone sitting in an office typing at a keyboard.

Anyone of you out there with OH&S experience will know that PPE (Personal Protection Equipment) is a long way down the list for safety protection. In fact it is the last call. Why do so many organisations put it in the forefront then. It is a last ditch effort when all else fails. Use it when needed but use discretion because sometimes it does not help. It is also cheaper than all other solutions.

I should point out that I do not like wearing gloves. I have to. Someone mentioned the lack of tactile feel when wearing them. I agree and would rather not wear them. However having large painful cracks in the tips of your fingers also affects tactile feel. Having decided to wear gloves thru necessity I have developed a method to protect myself. Stay away from rotating parts! I am as safe as any of you. Safety is in your hands, not in the hands of office dwellers. Stay safe

Dean

Socks? Sounds interesting. I don't have any kevlar protection garments but I remember a mate fully decked out, cutting a redgum log buried in a swamp. Rooster tails of water spraying out from the chain of his 99cc husky which is the one I now possess on a semi permament basis. I only cut firewood but you may recall I want to start milling one day. I cannot afford kevlar at this point. As per all other safety aspects I am very careful and inspect the area beforehand for risks. I usually cut in open areas on flat ground(the only type here). I have obtained the access to a pile of redgum in a neighbors paddock which is from shire road clearing. Branches from a large tree. He has the trunk set aside himself.

Dean

Originally Posted by Oldneweng

Anyone of you out there with OH&S experience will know that PPE (Personal Protection Equipment) is a long way down the list for safety protection. In fact it is the last call. Why do so many organisations put it in the forefront then. It is a last ditch effort when all else fails. Use it when needed but use discretion because sometimes it does not help. It is also cheaper than all other solutions.

Dean

Hi Dean,

Yes, PPC is the last option in the hierarchy of control measures for dealing with hazards. Elimination and substitution are the first two but they are often the most expensive. Somewhere down the list is engineering systems. In your example, cheaper and easier to give everyone a P2 dust mask than to install expensive dust extraction to eliminate the risk. Not the best option for worker comfort and overall safety though I wouldn't think....

In my line of work we rely heavily on PPC because the other control measures are not practical and generally out of our hands.

Cheers,

Simon

I have no experience with air bags in cars but considering my tally with my current car is about 30 roos, I wonder at what point the airbag will activate. At $1000 replacement cost (some years ago) that would be somewhat expensive.

A fellow worker had a crash some years ago in avoiding a roo and hit a tree. I would have preferred to hit the roo myself, but he had a massive black eye which he said was common for airbag activation. It was caused by his watch which was forced into his face, along with his arm by the airbag. Small price to pay considering he would have been travelling at speed. The car was totalled.

My preference is to avoid the roo and the tree, but hit the roo if you have too. My car is still going. One of my issues with airbags is that they will effect your view and actions in a crash situation. Again protecting the lowest common denominator. I have had many serious traffic situations but have never had a serious accident. My only impacts with other cars is in carparks.

In relation to safety matters with road vehicles I am reminded of a comment made by a friend and fellow worker from some years ago who is now deceased due to an impact with his harley and an emu when returning home on the morning after a celebration at another mates place. Out bush.

He commented on the problem with using headlights on motorbikes when riding away from the sun near to dusk or dawn. The issue was that the bike was made invisible as the headlight made it look like the sun that the oncoming driver was driving towards. I thought that this was only a very small part of the day and of the total risk. I still feel that all vehicles should use headlights at all times. Out here in the country it is obvious to me that headlights make a vehicle visible much sooner.

Safety is in the eye of the beholder and sometimes the beholder has a less than truthful vision.

Dean