Thread: Hafco 960b querys.

That block of steel (at the right hand side of the carriage) is the saddle lock. It's designed to be left loose in normal operation and then clamped up tight when facing off and parting off to stop the carriage moving. I made a threaded tommy bar to make it more convenient to use. From memory it's a 7/16 UNC thread. If it helps I'll take photos and post - let me know.

If you are worried about the gearbox it may be worth draining the oil and refilling, the drain plug is on the left hand end of the gearbox case under the end cover.

The rubber plug you describe is the oiling port for the quick change gearbox (aka the threading gearbox) on the front of the lathe. This leads to a tray which has a number of holes that drip oil onto the gears - this is a total loss system unlike the main gearbox. The idea is that you squirt hydraulic oil into this area occasionally when you are using the QC gearbox - don't worry that it drips out into the swarf tray, that's normal.

Regarding the gear noise, it may be that the unit in the shop was running without the quick change box being driven, normally you leave the QC gearbox out of mesh unless using the threading or power feed modes. The QC box is brought into play via the round knob at the left just underneath the main speed change levers.

If you are running the lathe at high speed you shouldn't run the QC gearbox in the higher gears (ie at the A end of the first sectiony). Generally I leave the QC box in D or E when I'm power feeding. Obviously you use all QC positions when threading but you don't thread at high spindle speeds. The QC box is very noisy (they are straight cut gears after all) if you leave it in a higher gear and run the lathe at fast speeds - scared me witless the first (and only) time I did that!

Also, looking at your photos it doesn't look like you have any grease on the gear-train, this will generate noise as well.

Changing the belt is slightly difficult with the standard belt, I had to take the 127/120 change wheel off to get the belt off the pulley and loosen the splash back to move the motor. The fan shroud was hitting the splash-back so I had to move that temporarily while moving the motor. I bought a replacement belt from CBC Bearings that was very slightly longer and that resolved the issue re the splash back but not the requirement to take the idler gear off each time - I generally just leave the belt in the lower speed position most of the time.

The lower (and upper) gearbox cover mountings on my lathe are as you describe, a double ended stud with a nut locking it to the gearbox casing. I can post photos if you want.

The socket head cap screws at the far end of the cross slide are there for an optional taper turning attachment, they serve no purpose unless that attachment is used so you can use them to bolt your fittings to. I use them the hold my oiling system. I'd be leery of bolting anything with too much weight using them though - I'd be inclined to mount the light on the spash-back and use the cross-slide bolts for the coolant/oiling system.

Those bolts in the picture you refer to are part of the method of aligning the headstock to the ways - don't mess with them!

If you are in any doubt about the oil and/or any damage you should talk to the supplier asap as it will still be under warranty.

Rgds - Gavin

As far as the noise goes. Did you have the cover off the left hand side? On my lathe this cover can rub against the pulley if not in just right spot. Also is the power feed gear in neutral? (it appears to be in your picture of moving the lathe in your other thread) as Gavin says those gears make lots of noise even when adjusted properly, even more it adjusted to tight.(the ones on my lathe can out of line and on and angle, but i have the Chinese one)
Stuart

thanks for the replies.
managed to change the belt to low speed.
cant understand why the belt isn't at least 1 cm longer, there is plenty of adjustment on the motor bracket for a slightly larger belt.

managed to fit the chuck, thought this would be an easy job, could not get the cam locks anywhere near between the center of the arrow marks, (more like half way between the start mark and the first arrow when turning clockwise), If i loosened the cam lock stud 1 turn there was no locking pressure, called H&F, the service person said not to worry just as long as its tight.

thought this doesn't seem to be properly locked.
Decided to sand the cam-lock studs radius, as the surface looked rough, used a pipe with a similar radius and wet and dry 400 grit paper.
worked well on 2 of these studs first pop, though the 3rd wouldn't line up between the 2 arrow marks after 10 attempts ( after each attempt there was some new scored marks on the cam lock stud, there must be a lip on the inner cam, can these cams be pulled out ? ).
removed a stud from the 4 jaw chuck plate, this worked perfectly as it was.

The other problem is the chuck itself was rough and locking up while tightening or loosening.
took the jaws out and flooded the chuck with oil,its a little smoother but still locks up in certain positions, is this normal or could it be full of contamination.
wasted over 4 hours just to get a chuck in.

Stuart, ran it with and without the cover, plus gave it a short run with the gears disconnected, could be louder, due to the cabinet.
May need to hand turn the chuck of a 960b demo in store to compare the feel.

The cam lock studs come out easy, just undo the allen head bolt holding them in which is next to each cam lock.
A picture of the cam lock is below. You can see were I had to move the detent hole over because one of the cam locks wouldn't line up when open.

What I have found with these Chinese chucks is they have burrs along the slot for the jaw. Take the jaw out and use a fine file to remove them.

Do all H&F lathes come with a total loss oil system in the thread gear box? Mine runs in a bath of oil with a sight glass on the side.

Dave

Originally Posted by lather

thanks for the replies.
managed to change the belt to low speed.
cant understand why the belt isn't at least 1 cm longer, there is plenty of adjustment on the motor bracket for a slightly larger belt.

Take the belt to CBC Bearings (or similar) and ask them for the US equivalent - it'll be just enough longer to be easier to move. Too long and the pulley fouls the cover but the US made Gates belt I got does nicely.

managed to fit the chuck, thought this would be an easy job, could not get the cam locks anywhere near between the center of the arrow marks, (more like half way between the start mark and the first arrow when turning clockwise), If i loosened the cam lock stud 1 turn there was no locking pressure, called H&F, the service person said not to worry just as long as its tight.

That's odd, I had no trouble with any of the chucks or the faceplate on mine, one turn of the studs moved them about 1/2 way between the two marks on the registers so setting it up to be between the 2 lines was simple. Is it possible to post pictures?

thought this doesn't seem to be properly locked.
Decided to sand the cam-lock studs radius, as the surface looked rough, used a pipe with a similar radius and wet and dry 400 grit paper.
worked well on 2 of these studs first pop, though the 3rd wouldn't line up between the 2 arrow marks after 10 attempts ( after each attempt there was some new scored marks on the cam lock stud, there must be a lip on the inner cam, can these cams be pulled out ? ).
removed a stud from the 4 jaw chuck plate, this worked perfectly as it was.

The other problem is the chuck itself was rough and locking up while tightening or loosening.
took the jaws out and flooded the chuck with oil,its a little smoother but still locks up in certain positions, is this normal or could it be full of contamination.
wasted over 4 hours just to get a chuck in.

Take the chuck back if it's locking up. H&F put Chinese chucks on the lathe (which I think is short sighted) in order to keep the cost down, if the chuck is not working properly then have them replace it under warranty. If it's tight in spots, oil it and it'll work in but if it locks up I'd be returning it.

Stuart, ran it with and without the cover, plus gave it a short run with the gears disconnected, could be louder, due to the cabinet.
May need to hand turn the chuck of a 960b demo in store to compare the feel.

See comments in red.

I forgot to put in earlier about the cam studs.

On one of my face plates or chucks, I remember I had to move the studs to different holes to get it to line up between the marks. This is because the threads in each hole and stud start at a different place which in turn gives them a different height when lined up at each full turn.
The pitch on these studs is 1mm and some only needed 0.5mm in height difference to get them to line up.

Dave

Lather,a couple of things you can try on your camlocks, on the 3 jaw swap the worst two pins and see if this helps. If this doesnt help, mount the 4 jaw chuck and check which pin is the worse in that, swap that pin for the worse pin in the 3 jaw. You should be able to get the arrow between the lines.. thats what the lines are there for.

It maybe not be the pins, on my faceplate the camlocks have to be pulled up slowly, a little on each. If you do one up then move the the others you can't do them up. I believe this is because the taper in the faceplate isnt correct.(one of these days I'll start a thread about that)
Stuart

Hi Stuart,
I wrote this up previously in another thread

If your having trouble with the chuck it might be with the taper. Check to see if there is a gap between the two flat mating surfaces of the spindle nose and the backplate.
I picked up a spare D14 mount chuck and found the taper was slightly smaller so it was rocking on my lathes D14 locating taper depending which cam lock you tightened.
I ended up mounting the new 4 jaw back wards into my original 4 jaw and taking a very small cut off the taper then remove the whole lot turn it around and try it. The last little bit was taken off with emery cloth. It took a few goes and but it is fine now and runs true.

Dave

Sorry I missed it if it was in answer to me Dave.
Yes I think that is the problem. I'm just worried that its a little beyond my turning skills just yet. Holding it could be a problem also. But knowing that it's been done before makes me a little happier about trying it.
I'd been thinking for ages "why do they bother on face plates and 4 jaw chucks anyway?" I guess its more about being sure the chuck wont move when working than having the faceplate line up exactly each time.
Thanks
Stuart

Hi Stuart,
No I wrote that up on a thread that Dingo Dog had started, here is the link
https://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/th...chucks-114404/
It just saved me rewriting it all.

You are right, the D1-4 mount is made for good repeatability when reinstalling chucks, face plates or anything else. Were the taper comes in with the 4 jaw chucks and face plates is to keep them central that way they are balanced.
They are not perfect, sometimes when I am setting up for a precision job I find tightening up different cam locks makes a difference.

It is also a good idea to rotate the chuck on the cam locks until you find the most accurate mounting position, then mark the spindle and the chuck or back plate so it can always be mounted back on the same.
Below is a picture of my spindle, you can see I used the V out of my letter punch set to mark it. You can also see the 2 centre punch marks on the back plate and chuck were the chuck runs the best on the back plate.

Dave

the fitting of the chuck looks fine, the main concern i had was the reply by H&F that it doesn't matter if its not between the arrows, i didn't believe it so
did a little sanding on the cam lock studs radius.
Last thing i wanted was a chuck flying off.
had tried different cam lock positions in which 2 had come near the arrow and the 3rd about half way between the straight start mark and the first arrow.
had marked this position when repeatedly sanding the stubborn cam stud.
When replacing this stud with 1 off the 4 jaw chuck , it worked perfectly, so I'd say the machining isn't accurate, i assumed this was all tested before
purchase.

Dave j, thanks for the cam lock pics, will pull out the cam locks as it looks like 1 has a slight burr.
hope the burr doesn't interfere when pulling it out.

Will be taking back the chuck, forgot to mention- it gets tight without the jaws in the chuck, i can see this being a pain when using,
Are chucks meant to be fairly smooth, easy 1 handed operation when adjusting the jaws, when it locks i need to use both hands on the key with a little strain to get it to work ? its very jerky with or without the jaws.
expecting to be told its normal when i return the chuck.
Need to check if the 4 jaw has the same problem before returning the 3 jaw.

its a little more work than i thought when setting up a lathe.

That chuck sounds like the scroll is binding, it should turn easy with the jaws out. It's not your problem to fix it since it's under warranty, I would take it back to H&F.

Dave
PS
PM sent

Originally Posted by lather

Will be taking back the chuck, forgot to mention- it gets tight without the jaws in the chuck, i can see this being a pain when using,
Are chucks meant to be fairly smooth, easy 1 handed operation when adjusting the jaws, when it locks i need to use both hands on the key with a little strain to get it to work ? its very jerky with or without the jaws.
expecting to be told its normal when i return the chuck.
Need to check if the 4 jaw has the same problem before returning the 3 jaw.

its a little more work than i thought when setting up a lathe.

You definitely should not have to force the scroll, as Dave says - take it back and get it replaced. You seem to have been unlucky with your chuck(s), mine were fine straight off with no fettling required.

I assume you were supplied with Fuerda chucks, these are good chinese chucks but being chinese the quality is likely to be variable. I was surprised that H&F supplied chinese chucks on the taiwanese made lathe but I was told that it was a cost thing.

Hi,
The quality and the parts vary on the Fuedra Chinese chucks.
Here is one story
The 250mm chuck I bought from H&F had one jaw that never even touched the screw.
I tried the jaw in my 200mm chuck and found it fitted, so it came with 3 x 250mm jaws and one 200mm jaw.
They took the chuck back then gave me a new one but it cost me $50 in fuel for the trip. While I was there I checked the jaws in the new chuck and they were fine.
After getting it out at home to use it, I found the safety chuck key was to big for the chuck You cant win them all. I never bothered going back again, I just threw it in the cupboard and used the one off my other 4 jaw chuck, one day I will get around to milling it down.
Both of these chuck boxes had been opened before I got them.

Dave