I hate to start another lathe thread, but....

[BBP]

Hi all,
I have searched, I believe quite exhaustively for comments on the following question, and find few. So...
I am looking at buying a small lathe, and one thing I have noticed is the location of the hand wheel on the carriage, differs. Seems that the yanks have it on left and english lathes on the right. Is there any real issue with having it on the left?. I can see that swarf etc may land on your hand by having it there. Also I thought about banging ones hand into the casing on the "headstock", right name?, but I gather one would probably hit the chuck with the tool before that happened. So what is the consensus?. Or is it a bit like tablesaws, left, right, all personal preference. I am leaning to the right myself, just looks safer somehow.

Of the couple of the units I have seen one( C4 from carbatec) is on the left, not preferred, but the unit has some other nice features, powered slide being one. A 9x20 steelmaster is on the right, but no powered cross slide.
I was almost about to go and buy a Taiwanese lathe at about $7K, that DRO stuff had me, as I am a sucker for nerd knobs. But comon sense prevailed, and I thought the damage from an error on a smaller one whilst learning would be less.

Cheers

Robin

[pipeclay]

In my opinion with the smaller hobby lathes theres no difference with having the carraige hand wheel on the left or right,as you said earlier user prefference.
If you were doing a lot of longitudinal machining and using carbide tools you would find that you could possibly get a few burns from the chips with the handle on the left.
This is something you would have to get used too,you could possably put some type of gaurding in place to reduce the chance if you wanted.
In regards to chooseing a small lathe how much facing will you be doing to require power cross feed,unless you a doing a lot and a large diameter in my opinion its not really needed.
It can although be handy when parting off.

[radish]

OK, here's my take on this situation, I do happen to work as a machinist/fitter & turner as my day job and have had to use both these differnt positions of the handles.

If you are naturally right handed, then it is much easier to use a lathe which has the carriage handle to the right hand side of the carriage. You can control the cariage feed rate far easier with the dominant hand.
One which has the carriage wheel on the left, is just not comfortable for me at all, but, it works wonderfully well, for a left handed person.

If you are a right hander, then go and try each different lathe out, to see which one you can control the easiest, nothing worse than turning the carriage handle the wrong way and listening to the chuck jaws demolishing the tooling as you crash it into the chuck.

None to sure why the poms put the handle on the right and the yanks had to be different, so they put their stuff on the left, all very confusing for a natural right hander.

regards radish

[new_guy90]

Hi all,
I have searched, I believe quite exhaustively for comments on the following question, and find few. So...
I am looking at buying a small lathe, and one thing I have noticed is the location of the hand wheel on the carriage, differs. Seems that the yanks have it on left and english lathes on the right. Is there any real issue with having it on the left?. I can see that swarf etc may land on your hand by having it there. Also I thought about banging ones hand into the casing on the "headstock", right name?, but I gather one would probably hit the chuck with the tool before that happened. So what is the consensus?. Or is it a bit like tablesaws, left, right, all personal preference. I am leaning to the right myself, just looks safer somehow.

Of the couple of the units I have seen one( C4 from carbatec) is on the left, not preferred, but the unit has some other nice features, powered slide being one. A 9x20 steelmaster is on the right, but no powered cross slide.
I was almost about to go and buy a Taiwanese lathe at about $7K, that DRO stuff had me, as I am a sucker for nerd knobs. But comon sense prevailed, and I thought the damage from an error on a smaller one whilst learning would be less.

Cheers

Robin

your dead on with everything there, english right and american left it doesnt really matter what side you will get used to the set up after awhile (you need quick hands on the dials for thread most cutting both hands that is) as for a small lathe well there is heaps of stuff on the net on how to "tune" up the lathe so it will work the best it can for you i sugest looking at these sites to get an idea of what they can do and chose the best for you (most hobby stuff is small and short so why go for that centre lathe when you will never use is?) if you do get a small lathe dont worry if it doesnt have the powerd cross feed for the most part it wont help much, DRO is very handy but again you dont really need it for the small stuff

hope thats given you some help but what exactly did you want the lathe for?

[radish]

Forgot to add, do not buy a small lathe, buy the biggest one you can afford, by buying small, it will limit you forever to small.
You can turn small stuff on a big lathe, but you can never turn big stuff, on a small lathe.

Buy the biggest your pocket can afford, unless you only ever want to turn small stuff.

regards radish

[Big Shed]

.........if you do get a small lathe dont worry if it doesnt have the powerd cross feed for the most part it wont help much, DRO is very handy but again you dont really need it for the small stuff

As a proud and very satisfied owner of the before mentioned 9x20 Steelmaster, variable speed model, I can say I have not yet missed the powered cross feed. Maybe I will at some stage, and I have been busy collecting info on power feed mods in the mean time.

What I do miss is DROs, on the tailstock, on the x and y axis, that would make my life so much easier. I can't really see why "you don't really need it for the small stuff". Surely that sort of convenience and accuracy doesn't change with whether you turn large or small stuff.

The one thing that is a "must have" as far as I was concerned before I bought a lathe is the EVS, now having owned one for a little while, I still think so in spades.

The other nice feature is the cam lock on the tail stock, very quick to use, no fiddling with spanners. I can see why that is one of the top mods for new 9x20 owners, great to have it as standard.
Particularly while learning, the ability to change speed at the "flick of a dial" as opposed to belt changes, enables (and encourages) one to quickly experiment with various speeds and see their effect.

As to right vs left, I'm right handed, the Steelmaster wheel is on the right, I have had hot swarf/chips on my hand. So I really don't think it makes a difference.

[BBP]

Thanks for the replies guys, helps to make the decision process easier.

Radish, I am right dominant, so the wheel on the right hand side would be more "normal". Hmm, I was trying to decide if powered slide was going ti be a must have. At the moment I would not have a real use for it. DRO however, now that's something I could really use. Only I understand they won't really fit the small lathes.
Yes, I have read before the recommendation to buy the biggest one can afford. I have been looking at the AL-336D or one of the Taiwanese ones, and am quite prepared to drop that sort of coin, if and, only if I think I will make good use of it. I'm of the view that if you buy a tool only worth $20 and don't use it then thats a waste of money, whereas if you spend $5000 on a tool and make good use of it then it was a worthwhile purchase. My problem is space and the possibility of having to move it at times. Though I can put wheels on a bigger one to move it around.

new_guy90,
most of the things I have in mind at present are small. I need to make some bushes to fix a sloppy side stand on my motorcycle. Also need to do one for the car. Which was one of the main drivers to get a lathe. I had a worn bush in the back of the gearbox where the tail shaft goes in. One cannot buy the bush from the car manufacturer, have to buy the entire assembly, $900+, and from Japan. So I took the car into a workshop, they knew some "engineers", who turned up a new one, all fitted, etc. Cost a bit less than $500, not bad I thought. The bush lasted 100kms, before I felt the vibrations coming back, by 500kms it was stuffed, back the was it was. Seems they used brass, or so I was told. So having wasted $500, on so called "pros", I thought, i'll find out what caused it to wear out in the first place. Then why not get my own lathe, find out what sort of "bearing bronze" or whatever would be best. " and make it myself. Cannot do any worse, can I.
That and I have an interest in model railways and wish to make steam engines etc. So nothing very big. If I find I consistently need a bigger one, I 'll go buy it when I need it.

Big Shed,
the steelmaster seems to be one of the better 9x20s I have seen. Any problems with yours?. I spoke to asset, and they seem pretty friendly. May come down to Melbourne and have a look, probably pick one up if they seem ok. Is there a speed display, can't tell from the pictures, if not should not be too hard to add one. It looks like you still a gearbox, so does that mean the gearbox can be used to a "range", and the speed control, varies it in that range. Or is it continuous between 125 - 2000. I know the
chinese lathes are all cheap and cheerful, so don't I expect miracles.

Cheers

Robin

[bollie7]

Robin

If someone is just starting out, as you are, the hand wheel position should not be a problem. You will get used to whichever one you end up with.
I believe the biggest problem is once you are used to one type, if you have to change to the other and have an "oops" moment. You instincts take over and can make the "oops" moment worse.
ie if you are used to using a machine with the saddle handwheel on the right and the cross slide on the left, (I'll call it a right hand machine) your instinctive reaction during an "oops" moment is to wind the right handwheel clockwise and the left handwheel anti-clockwise to get the tool away from the job/chuck.
If you have to use a machine with the other type of handwheel setup and have an "oops" moment, there is a good chance that you will react as you would with a right hand machine thus putting the tool further into the job/chuck.
As to the reason for the difference in handwheel positions, I asked the same question a while ago on one of the US based forums. The most popular reason given was that way back when, the British made a lot more gap bed machines than the USA did and a gap bed machine has the handwheel on the right as when the gap is removed, the LHS of the saddle moves off the end of the lathe bedways into the gap. By having the handwheel on the right there is no chance of the handwheel pinion coming out of mesh with the rack on the front of the machine.

regards
bollie7

[Big Shed]

Big Shed,
the steelmaster seems to be one of the better 9x20s I have seen. Any problems with yours?. I spoke to asset, and they seem pretty friendly. May come down to Melbourne and have a look, probably pick one up if they seem ok. Is there a speed display, can't tell from the pictures, if not should not be too hard to add one. It looks like you still a gearbox, so does that mean the gearbox can be used to a "range", and the speed control, varies it in that range. Or is it continuous between 125 - 2000. I know the
chinese lathes are all cheap and cheerful, so don't I expect miracles.

Cheers

Robin

No, no problems at all (so far). Service from Asset has been good, again so far.
Yes the Steelmaster has an LCD speed display, only thing I can fault is that it sits flat on top and is hard to read. I have made up a litlle aluminium guard and put it at 45deg, now it is easy to read, put up a photo of this somewhere (will have to find it).
There is still a High and Low range, the EVS works within these 2 ranges. The other side benfit of EVS is that it acts like a brake. When threading you can hit the stop button and the lathe stops there and then, very hand when working up to a shoulder.
Am looking at making a clamp on stop switch to make this easier to do.

Edit: here it is

https://www.woodworkforums.com/showth...ighlight=lathe

[BBP]

Hi bollie7,

Had not thought of the gap. Makes perfect sense. I went and looked at all the hare&forbes lathes which have the gap capacity and the handwheel is on the right on all of them. Since the small ones don't have the gap, it does not matter which side it is. Will still probably get one on the right though, because if I do upgrade to a bigger one it will have a gap option and the wheel will then be in a "natural" position for me.
Now back to how I can get to Melbourne without the wife knowing....

[bollie7]

Now back to how I can get to Melbourne without the wife knowing....

Aah Hah, Thats easy, Casually mention that you heard that the Markets in Melbourne are really big and have some cheap clothes etc (what ever your wife likes) and that maybe you should go down some time to have a look. Plant the seed. Once it grows and you are in Melbourne, it would be a shame if you went all that way and didn't just check out a few machinery places while you were there.
bollie7

[Anorak Bob]

Hello Robin,

If you venture into milling with your lathe, you would find powered cross feed a real bonus. Aside from milling, I have found the power feed invaluable for facing large diameters.

Regards Bob.

[new_guy90]

new_guy90,
most of the things I have in mind at present are small. I need to make some bushes to fix a sloppy side stand on my motorcycle. Also need to do one for the car. Which was one of the main drivers to get a lathe. I had a worn bush in the back of the gearbox where the tail shaft goes in. One cannot buy the bush from the car manufacturer, have to buy the entire assembly, $900+, and from Japan. So I took the car into a workshop, they knew some "engineers", who turned up a new one, all fitted, etc. Cost a bit less than $500, not bad I thought. The bush lasted 100kms, before I felt the vibrations coming back, by 500kms it was stuffed, back the was it was. Seems they used brass, or so I was told. So having wasted $500, on so called "pros", I thought, i'll find out what caused it to wear out in the first place. Then why not get my own lathe, find out what sort of "bearing bronze" or whatever would be best. " and make it myself. Cannot do any worse, can I.
That and I have an interest in model railways and wish to make steam engines etc. So nothing very big. If I find I consistently need a bigger one, I 'll go buy it when I need it.


Robin

you have to be careful when getting stuff made for your car because people may say they know what they are doing but really they havent a clue to be honest $500 for a bung sounds crap when i know i can do it at work in 2 sec's oh yeah and i to am looking to get a lathe this is my choice. the tempting thing to do it get the biggest one but i stress think about what you need it for and what you may have to use it to do. now DRO is very handy especialy for when your learning but you dont need it to do an accurate job and to be honest i dont think it will improve the lathes accuracy at all.

oh one thing that you need to think about is measuring tools this again is personal pref but buy good quality Mitutoyo tools, they are far better than the cheep ones they will be easier to use and look after .........last off make sure you know how to use your measuring equipment trust me its so easy to screw up

tooling all im going to say here is dont go for carbide just get the square HSS and look on the net to learn how to grind it. im sure half the hobby users who use carbide dont use it properly, if you need it latter ask in a post and we will try and help you avoid some head achs and save some cash.

right thats most of it i think

[radish]

Robin, now that scary forbes AL 336 lathe is a beauty, it's just a tad smaller than the thingy that I drive at work.

The speed range on it seems a bit slow at the top end, 1400 rpm is very slow if you intend to do small items like 6mm and under. The smaller you go, the higher the revs you will need to get a good finish, it's called surface speed, like how fast is the diameter travelling passed the tip of the tool.
Big diameter, slower revs, real small diameter, lots faster revs.

Have you had a good look around at what's available secondhand, every now and then a gem pops up, you have to be in the right place at the right time, that's the only drawback.


Good luck with whatever you decide on.

regards radish

[BBP]

Thanks Big Shed, your photos helped a lot. Nice stand/cabinet btw. Pity the display is flat, if I get one I will have to raise as you did, or turn it around and mount a small mirror to see it in the vertical plane. I have to admit, now I know it has a display, it's getting a more likely choice, in a 9x20.
re the stop switch, it that an instant stop or does it coast a couple of revs first. I was thinking about speed controlling an AC motor lathe, not that difficult. and one way to stop them quick is to give then a squirt of dc. Might be a bit stressful for the mechanics, and might void warranty. I was thinking about a switch to auto stop it for threading, by mounting a microswitch on to the arm of a magnetic dial gauge stand. Could be repositioned easily, and can be triggered by being hit by part of the carriage/saddle.
I see you bought your quick change toolpost from the US, why?, was it it price, quality, or availability?.

new_guy90,
yes it was a lesson learned, even by the 4x4 guys who removed the assembly. They weren't impressed either. At least if I get the proper assembly the offered to fit it for free, and so they should. It is an unfortunate truth that Canberra has an overabundance of "dud" tradies. Almost everyone I know has had some problem or other with tradies.

Already have some Mitutoyo micrometers, nice stuff. Went old school, no digital, as I already have digital verniers etc, and when I go to use them the batteries are often flat. So now I keep a few spare in a draw.

Radish,
I looked around a bit for secondhand, problem is I would not know a good lathe from a stuffed one. Plus they are almost always too far away to go look. If they are any good then locals snap them up right quick. So I'll take the hit on a new item and mod/fix it to do what I need it to do. Hopefully time and experience will tell me what I really need in a lathe in the future.


Thanks all, for the informative comments, it's been very useful.


Cheers

Robin