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Thread: The Journey for a Master Square
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28th February 2013, 09:16 PM #46SENIOR MEMBER
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Yeah the software can give me the weight and volume centre of mass, moments of inertia, thermal deformation etc. It started just a straight box section but the FEA showed it was to flimsy.
I also modelled up the pattern so that I could send it off the the foundries to get an accurate estimate on moulding and casting along with the weights and volume of the casting excluding the delivery system.
Attached is the 3D pdf of the split pattern, 2 degree draft, all edges filleted and a dimensions changed to allow for machining and shrinkage.
I think I said it earlier in the thread. The raw casting would be ~35kg and one finished square would be about 29kg
Some Impractical storage:
Storage Box.JPG
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28th February 2013 09:16 PM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
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1st March 2013, 12:37 AM #47SENIOR MEMBER
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it needed a name plate
MasterSquareNamePlate.JPG
actually it was just was just because I was reading the reading the etched bass name plates thread
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1st March 2013, 10:01 AM #48GOLD MEMBER
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Hi Josh,
You think it would be easy to control with handles like that?
Would some sort of T of D handle make things easier?
Oc course I dont have to design it
Stuart
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1st March 2013, 10:26 AM #49SENIOR MEMBER
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Thanks Stuart, Tee or Dee handles are a much better idea.
Ok so I decided last night that the prices to get it cast at a processional foundry are good enough to do it that way. Next step is making the pattern.
Design is not the problem making a pattern to match the design is. I always seem to have a problem getting the draft and fillets right at corners.
I'm gonna have a go at roughing out the pattern today in between other things. Any more fantastic ideas before I commit to physical form
My first step will be to make the 2 degree trapezoidal shape that will be the cross section of the external and internal "walls".
-Josh
'
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1st March 2013, 10:43 AM #50
Can you make the pattern in machineable wax and cnc it?
I'd be interested to know what the pricing is like, if you don't want to post it I'll talk to you about it tomorrow.1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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1st March 2013, 10:56 AM #51SENIOR MEMBER
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It is just a fraction to big for the little cnc.
But I also had the idea of making 2 more sets of patterns for a set of 150mm and a 100mm squares of similar design, and I could knock them out on the cnc out of machineable wax and then cast aluminium masters patterns, as the wax is not so good for multi time uses.
I don't think I should post the quotes, it does not feel ethical. I'm happy to tell you in private just not on a public space. I will say that it is much cheaper than buying new stock and machining the excess away.
-Josh
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1st March 2013, 02:26 PM #52
Hi Stuart,
Good point, I'm not entirely sure why handles are needed, Maybe temperature effects, but this is primarily for fixturing, not gauging... but I'm thinking they might just get in the way for clamping different jobs, on that basis I'm thinking removable handles might be better?
Regards
Ray
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1st March 2013, 04:21 PM #53GOLD MEMBER
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Hi Ray,
I assumed the handles would be removable. At 30kgs handles would be nice, I'd hate to drop one(maybe a threaded hole for an eyebolt and a hoist would be better for old guys like me). Though if a D or T handle is used, depending on how close those ribs come to the ends you might be able to get them below the surface? *
Stuart
*You could even cast them in for that extra pattern/core making challange
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1st March 2013, 05:12 PM #54SENIOR MEMBER
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Handles are there for all those reasons, as well as to keep my hands off the surfaces as much as possible. The way I see it the masters would not come out often other than to grind up other fixtures, like angle plates.
Handles will be removable on M12 thread to suit standard eyebolts or whatever you can put a M12 thread on, it also could be slung though the "cores".
30kg is a lot to lift up, it is about the same as our compound sine table and that is a real trial to move around carefully.
The other reason is that it will wring strongly to the mag chuck so a little extra leverage will be handy.
-Josh
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1st March 2013, 05:54 PM #55Philomath in training
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1st March 2013, 06:10 PM #56Pink 10EE owner
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Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.
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1st March 2013, 07:30 PM #57SENIOR MEMBER
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1st March 2013, 08:44 PM #58Philomath in training
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The you-tube clip is interesting but relies on something else being square. I know that squares can be generated much like surface plates using a flat surface and three squares, but checking with a dial indicator has me flummoxed. The only way that I can come close to a way is with an indicator stand that will allow the indicator to travel vertically but once again that relies on the direction of travel being perpendicular to the surface.
Michael
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1st March 2013, 08:53 PM #59SENIOR MEMBER
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Put the cube on a plate and confirm top and bottom are parallel. If using a cylindrical square it's normally easier to do this with a micrometer (ie checked for taper). As they say in Thailand, Same Same ... but different. Turn the cube through 90 degrees so those faces are now perpendicular to the plate. Indicate one face, with the base of the stand up against the bottom of the cube and indicate the top. Spin it through 180 degrees and do the same for the opposite side. If the readings are the same the 3 faces are square with respect to each other (ie bottom on the plate, and the 2 faces just checked). You work your way around the cube that way. Squares are checked the same way, except a "bridge" needs to be built to butt up against. It doesn't take long to check and will be as square as your best measurement system.
Pete
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1st March 2013, 08:58 PM #60SENIOR MEMBER
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If you can check for parallel/ or create a parallel surface to indicate off, you can then use the reversal method with an indicator to determine squareness.
If your unclear as to what I mean I will take some photos/video
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