Thread: Lubrication System

No worries Simon, I think I have 450 - 500mm between the quill and the table ? I'll measure it if you want.

Have you thought about using a ball nose cutter ?

john

Well I spent most of yesterday milling the grooves in the saddle. It's a very groovy saddle now!

You certainly get a lot of feedback and feel when you mill with only your hands holding the workpiece!

I'm happy with the results but at the same time I'm glad it's done! I'm proud to say that I still have the 1/8 end mill that I started with, no breakages!

Hi John, I had considered using a ball nose cutter but I don't have one. Other than aesthetics, does it make a difference using a standard end mil?

I'm just waiting for some fittings to arrive so that I can finish the job....

Simon

That came up good, It might be an idea to cut a shallow channel in the top of the gib as well to get the oil over to the dovetail. Just make it double the width on the slots you have done and say half the depth so when you adjust the gib it will still line up to the saddle oil groove.

Dave

Originally Posted by simonl

I'm happy with the results but at the same time I'm glad it's done!

Pitty I just had an idea for you. Could you have some how clamped a nut to the mill and then used a piece of threaded rod to push against the casting? Still, a little late now and you got it done anyway

I've no idea which way is which. In the first picture you extended the middle groove off the way, is that to get oil to the dovetail?

Depending on which way you were feeding, you could tilt the head and have an elliptical ended cutter . I really dont know how well it would work and doubt the finish would be that good.(it may also be useful for cleaning up tee slots on a shaper table if it wont fit in your mill).

Stuart

Hi,

I was in a hurry when I last posted and forgot to say a few things.

Hi John, thanks mate, to do the Z saddle you really only need about 200mm headroom so you'd have plenty to spare!

Hi Dave, yep as you can see I was planning on extending the grooves into the dovetails. I always wondered if it was a good thing to do or not and seeing that Ray's had it from factory sealed the deal for me. I'm a bit hesitant to touch the gibb's, not that I'm suggesting it's not a good idea but I'm just a little concerned doing such a delicate slender piece of CI with the method I have used. In any case, the gibbs sit about 3mm lower than the edge of the way and so oil will naturally flow into the gibb. Whether it flows down onto the static side or the moving side is yet to be seen. I can make minor adjustments at a later stage. removing the gibbs is a 5 second job.

Hi Stuart,

Sorry I should explain the pics better. The first photo is the top of the X ways so the saddle is the correct way up. I extended the grooves so as to feed oil into the dovetails.

The second pic is obviously the Y ways. I have not extended the grooves here as I didn't see any point. The oil would just flow into the groove at the bottom of the dovetail and not flow up onto the dovetail itself. For this I have a different plan. The side without the gibb will have the oil feed going to two points. one point will intersect with the goove underneath, the same hole will be drilled all the way through and come out into the dovetail providing oil to the flat and the dovetails however I don't plan on putting any grooves on the dovetails themselves.

The side with the gibb I am yet to decide what to do. I plan on making a felt wiper for the front, perhaps enough oil will soak up in the felt to wick it to the gibb dovetail. Not sure, other than that, perhaps a separate oil line just above the gibb fed through the saddle. If I do that then there will be a lot of oil feeding to lots of places and I maybe making it more complex than it needs to be but if I'm making a one shot oiler, then I want it to be a one shot oiler and know that everything is sufficiently lubricated when it's activated.

Cheers,

Simon

Simon
Looking good, You are much more patient then me.
Just one question with the one shot system you are going to use and just looking at the x slide. Once you have pressurize the oil lines with the one shot, will not the oil find the least resistance and run on to the dovetail and gibb and not onto the x slides add least not to the ends of them?
Should you dam up the entry in to the gib and dovetail a bit to force the oil to the ends?

Russell

Any reason why you didnt just scrape the grooves.

Originally Posted by rusel

Simon
Looking good, You are much more patient then me.
Just one question with the one shot system you are going to use and just looking at the x slide. Once you have pressurize the oil lines with the one shot, will not the oil find the least resistance and run on to the dovetail and gibb and not onto the x slides add least not to the ends of them?
Should you dam up the entry in to the gib and dovetail a bit to force the oil to the ends?

Russell

Hi Russell,

I had thought the same thing. Time will tell. The oil will be injected at one end of the X, not the middle so overflow to the dovetails shouldn't be any easier than continuing along the x. Either way, by the time it get to where it can flow down, at least half the X as already filled anyway. I'm also assuming that each time it gets oiled it's not flowing into a dry path and that it will be half filled with residual oil anyway. If I find that it is an issue I can then look at partially filling the groove with metal putty or similar.

Hi Pipeclay,

Three reasons, firstly I still haven't made my hand scraper yet! . Secondly, I figured if I was going to do that then I may as well hand scrape the ways flat and I don't have a straight edge or a large enough surface plate to perform any of that work yet. Other people have done what I have done long ago and have reported that they are happy with the results and some manufacturers do it from new so I figured it must work. Also it's within my capabilities.

Cheers,

Simon

A piece of hss welded to a bit of mild would of sufficed,no need to of scraped the rest of it till you make your other one.
Wouldnt hurt to make one any way out of a bit of 3/16"/1/4" hss,with a radious on it so as to remove any sharp edge from the oil slot.

Originally Posted by rusel

Simon Once you have pressurize the oil lines with the one shot, will not the oil find the least resistance and run on to the dovetail and gibb and not onto the x slides add least not to the ends of them?
Should you dam up the entry in to the gib and dovetail a bit to force the oil to the ends?
Russell

Been thinking about this a little more. I may cut a strip of felt the length of the gibb and have it just sit on top. That would stop the flow but still wick oil in a more controlled method to the dovetail. The most difficult part in this would be to find a way of making sure it stays in place although there maybe a simple way to achieve this, I'll have a gander sometime tomorrow....

Simon

Thats a seriously creative bit of machining simon.
As they say "Where there's a will there's relatives". It seems the word 'fail' doesn't enter your vocabulary.

Phil

Hi Simon,
What sort of one shot system were you going to use? I know there was a long thread about them some time back, but one shot oilers made my head hurt so i gave up........

As per your PM i have my wipers off and will take a few snaps for you. The ones i have are just cheap pressed metal. The ones i made for Freddies ways were 1/4" brass with a 1/8" deep rebate all but 5mm from the outer edges. When you tighten the bolts up the felt kinda squeezes out onto the way. I tried 4 layers of everyday felt but it doesn't have the squashability needed. At least if i need to cut channels in my mill i can use the shaper now! I think it depends on the worker on the day as to what was actually done to these machines.

Thanks Phil!

In truth there have been many projects I have thought about and floated on this forum that have not been started due to self doubt and fear of making mistakes or simply because I felt that it was beyond my capabilities....... My TS still sits at the end of the lathe waiting to be hand scraped but I don't want to make it even worse. I figure if I don't touch it then I haven't f***ed it either!

Anyway, I have been concerned for a while about the lack of adequate lubrication of this machine. If I didn't do anything then it's going to wear to a point that will put it in worse condition then anything I can do to it!

Anyway I'm glad it's over. I don't think I will attempt something like that again. I got away with it without even a damaged end mill so I will cut my losses!

I doubt I would have been as successful with anything other than CI, I think it's almost as forgiving as brass!

Hi pipeclay, yes you are correct. I got lots of HSS floating around like most.

Hi Ueee, I got a few ideas at my disposal. I have a pump similar to this: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ntric_pump.gif

I recovered it from the treadmill I found. It originally was used to periodically deliver lubricant to the bed of the treadmill automatically at predetermined time intervals. It's driven by a small induction type motor (similar to a kitchen exhaust fan) and then through a small reduction gearbox so the pump rotates at about 60 rpm. This is probably my most likely approach at this stage. I like the idea of a push of a button type lube system.

Other option: I have a small 120W induction motor that I can couple to an oil pump I have that came off a kawasaki motorbike. It's a small gear type pump and it would probably produce enough oil pressure and volume for a dozen machines and so may be a bit of overkill. A hand crank option on the same pump is also a variation that may work.

I cheaper and easier method is a gravity feed system from an oil reservoir from above to produce the required head pressure. Oil flow would be slow which can also be used to advantage by allowing the system to remain "on" while the machine is powered up by using some unneeded 24V AC sprinkler solenoids I have.

Finally, an idea I got from DaveJ (thanks dave!) is to use a brake master cylinder and attach a lever to manually pump when required.

Brass wipers eh Ueee? That's sounds nice. I was thinking only mild steel. Brass, I like brass!

Cheers,

Simon

Hi Simon,
Here is a pic of the wiper of the front of my mill (HM50). It is only .6 or .8 thick. I'll do anything to postpone doing my paperwork for 10 mins......



Here is one of the brass ones that i havn't machined out the back of yet. The blue will all go with the rebate. I only used brass as i had a bit and the brass stroke length pointer looked a bit lonely as the only brass on the machine. I will just use MS for the rear one for the Y axis on the mill. (mine only came with one on the front). As you may guess i found another use for a shaper- to sit things on to take photo's!