Thread: Milling Machine Quality

Originally Posted by Alby123

I'm currently looking at buying a new mill for my workshop. Has anyone purchased any machinery from Paramount Brown's with regard to the quality of the machinery that they sell.
The mill I'm considering buying as a new mill is the Milling Machine - Dovetail Shaft Model MMD-45
The longitude travel is 505mm , the cross travel is 205mm. The spindle taper is a No. 4MT.
This mill is a bench/stand mounted mill, as it will be the first mill that I will be buying I would like to hear from anyone about these mills before I take the plunge and purchase it.
All comments are welcomed as this is new territory for me.
Cheers Alby

Like all Chinese made gear, there are good ones, so-so ones and mediocre ones. It depends on a lot of factors as to what you get so a close inspection is the key. You also need to consider the after-sales support of the local retailer, that's important when buying this sort of equipment.

Have you looked at General Tools yet?

Gavin (just up the road at Aberfoyle Park)

Hi Alby,
Good choice with the dovetail column.They are a very capable milling machine for the home shop and a few members here have them.

I have not bought off them but think they will be just the same as everyone else world wide.
I am on a lot of forums and the guys in the US are getting the same machines and problems as us over here, so they are all pretty much the same.

For the mill I have now I went down and looked at 2 mills (HM52) side by side in the Sydney H&F which both had come from the same container load.
One mill had a terrible grinding job on the table etc but a great bog and paint job, while the other one had a beautifully finished table etc but the bog job and paint was bad.
After checking them both over with measuring gear I picked the bad paint one as that can be fixed, but just goes to show how different they can be. Maybe one was a Friday job, or just a guy that didn't really care who knows.

I have some pictures of the manufacturing process over in china that I have been meaning to post up, so I will get onto it latter and post them up.
It's pretty dirty conditions over there where they are assembled, so well worth pulling your new machine apart and giving it a good clean out. This will also allow you to see and faults before the warranty is up.
I had a half of a 2 liter ice cream container of casting sand and loose cast iron out of my mill, but it is a bigger mill.


Have you seen the Titan machine, it is like the Industrial hobbies mill sold in the US that they all like to CNC or just use manually with a lot bigger table travel, Y travel, larger head collar which makes it more rigid etc.
It's priced at $2999 the last time I looked, so if your after something that has bigger travel without being much bigger of a machine have a look at that one.

Dave

Originally Posted by Alby123

I'm currently looking at buying a new mill for my workshop. Has anyone purchased any machinery from Paramount Brown's with regard to the quality of the machinery that they sell.
The mill I'm considering buying as a new mill is the Milling Machine - Dovetail Shaft Model MMD-45
The longitude travel is 505mm , the cross travel is 205mm. The spindle taper is a No. 4MT.
This mill is a bench/stand mounted mill, as it will be the first mill that I will be buying I would like to hear from anyone about these mills before I take the plunge and purchase it.
All comments are welcomed as this is new territory for me.
Cheers Alby

I would not buy a milling machine with a 4MT unless you're very sure that you won't be changing tools frequently. If you plan on buying an ER type collet chuck and using it 90%+ of the time, fine.

Otherwise I'd be looking for R8, ISO 30 or ISO 40 though this one is getting a bit big to expect in that size machine.

Not an issue of taper rigidity, 4MT is plenty rigid. Just all the Morse tapers are a PITA for fast tool changes compared to the self-releasing tapers.

PDW

A mate of mine got his lathe from Paramount Browns.When he asked about buying a spare compound slide (because he wanted to modify his) he was told to try Hare and Forbes as we don't sell spare parts.
John

I was going to say isn't Paramounts Stuff Taiwanese not Chinese, but it turns out thats just their bandsaws.

I have never had much luck with Chinese stuff, my new bandsaw just confirms this for me. The quality is appalling. IMHO your better to buy something 2nd hand that is not made in asia, but the problem with that of course is there aren't really any machines that small around unless you go into 13 or Theil or FP1 territory and you will pay far more fore one of these than a new Chinese machine. My opinion is if you have the space and time to look go something larger and 2nd hand. Not only will you have a more capable machine but it should keep it's value much better too.

Thanks for the quick responses, I do have time on my side so I don't have to rush out and buy one just to get a job done. I haven't looked at General Tools yet but will do so. As for the spare parts side I'll check on that too and let you know. Thank you for your opinions.
Alby

I think you will find general tools get them off H&F.

Dave

Hi Dave just had a quick look and you are right , some of the machinery does come from Hare & Forbes as they actually state this in the relevant items, not to mention the availability of spare parts as Paramount Brown's don't seem to mention spare parts on their web site. I'll give them a ring on Monday and find out what they have to say.
Cheers Alby

With spare parts most don't need them, it's mainly bearing and seals that need replacing down the track.


A good check over once you have it home and you will soon see if there is anything wrong with it.

Dave

I agree with Dave - for the most part, the parts that need sparing are bearing, seals and belts. You are better off buying name brand stuff from Gardiner's or CBC for that sort of part.

I am always surprised by people (and this is not intended as a dig at anyone in particular, including the OP) who want to buy a machine tool like they would a car. Apart from the fore mentioned bearing, seals and belts (and some but not all fasteners) all the parts that I've had to replace on machines I've made myself or on rare occasions asked someone to do it for me. All the parts that you would expect to wear on a machine can be re-made in most cases without too much trouble. The current lathe has had leadscrews & nuts replaced, guards, handles, scales, tensioner pulleys and switch quadrants made and the tailstock ram re-scaled. It's all part of learning about your machine and extending skills. Mills are not quite as simple as lathes, but still offer that opportunity.

Michael

Originally Posted by Alby123

Hi Dave just had a quick look and you are right , some of the machinery does come from Hare & Forbes as they actually state this in the relevant items, not to mention the availability of spare parts as Paramount Brown's don't seem to mention spare parts on their web site. I'll give them a ring on Monday and find out what they have to say.
Cheers Alby

check the gear out on H&F website...you can get direct from H&F in Vic but they charge an arm and a leg for freight to Adelaide. Cheaper to go thru General Tools Alby.

Thanks for the input everyone will investigate further and Ill update accordingly.
Alby

Originally Posted by Michael G

I agree with Dave - for the most part, the parts that need sparing are bearing, seals and belts. You are better off buying name brand stuff from Gardiner's or CBC for that sort of part.

I am always surprised by people (and this is not intended as a dig at anyone in particular, including the OP) who want to buy a machine tool like they would a car. Apart from the fore mentioned bearing, seals and belts (and some but not all fasteners) all the parts that I've had to replace on machines I've made myself or on rare occasions asked someone to do it for me. All the parts that you would expect to wear on a machine can be re-made in most cases without too much trouble. The current lathe has had leadscrews & nuts replaced, guards, handles, scales, tensioner pulleys and switch quadrants made and the tailstock ram re-scaled. It's all part of learning about your machine and extending skills. Mills are not quite as simple as lathes, but still offer that opportunity.

Michael

I put in my post about having a rotary table and being to make your own gears etc if needed, then deleted it because I didn't want him to think he might have to make them or scare him off buying one, LOL

Your totally right though, once you have a mill and a lathe you can pretty much make anything for the machine.

There are thousands of these machines around and I don't hear complaints where some one can't use it because of not being able to get a part. Some have a wind in the gear box, or leaking seals etc, but nothing that actually stops the machine, just annoying problems.

Dave

Originally Posted by Alby123

Hi Dave just had a quick look and you are right , some of the machinery does come from Hare & Forbes as they actually state this in the relevant items, not to mention the availability of spare parts as Paramount Brown's don't seem to mention spare parts on their web site. I'll give them a ring on Monday and find out what they have to say.
Cheers Alby

General Tools are indeed H&F agents, their after sales service to me has been excellent. When I had oil leak issues with my previous lathe in the warranty period they sent a fitter out to sort the issue out, the fitter was on site for a couple of hours - no cost. They are definitely worth a visit.