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30th May 2014, 11:10 AM #1
Is obtaining your engineering supplies getting difficult?
The thread about the toolmakers hammer was starting to drift badly so I suppose it was time to start another.
The thread on the toolmakers hammer made me realise that engineering stock I could easily obtain then is now getting much harder to obtain. Back in 20l1 ,just three years back and all was good. So much has changed now.
In my neck of the woods ,anyway,it was easy to obtain just about anything in the way of of hobby engineering materials. For me, most of that type of purchasing, came from what I call an engineering emporium, a large warehouse type building set up years ago to cater for the needs of the engineering side of the sugar and then fledgling coal industry.
When I hit Mackay in 1994 I found I could buy anything from pulleys to pumps, and all of the tools and spares and associated minutiae of small items connected with engineering repair and manufacture.
I did not hit my stride until 2007 when I purchased a lathe and purchased most of my turning needs from this business. Again I could buy drill bits ,taps,mill cutter, off the shelves ,no problem.Up to 201l it was Ok then it changed.
Two or three years on and so much has changed.
Solid round bar in copper brass and stainless steel 304 and 316 was available ,I stress was available at that local engineering emporium.One could buy a short length cut off from a selection on the racks.
With the times being what they are ,there are lots of copper ,and brass sections no longer kept in stock as they do not sell much now, so as stock was sold off it, was never replaced.
It is the same all over the shop now, empty spaces on the shelves .Its getting to the point where I now go elsewhere for most items as I know it will be a wasted trip to go there.
I saw part of this coming a couple of years ago and started buying my materials excess to requirements.If I needed 1, I would buy 2. I am now waiting on construction of a 15 x 6 shed to house all my machinery and stock.That can't happen till the concreter gets here and that won't happen until it stops raining every other day.
There are lots of other businesses that sell the run of the mill stuff ,but stuff like brass and copper sections is just exotic for them. I realise times have changed and industry in the main just buys the spares and has them up overnight. Its a shame really as I would spend around $20 a week on average in that shop . That's $20,000 over 20 years and astounds me now when I look back.
How do you blokes fare for your engineering supplies?
Grahame
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30th May 2014 11:10 AM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
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30th May 2014, 12:29 PM #2
Hi Grahame,
Despite the fact we have very little industry here we have several good stores, including Blackwoods and CBC. My "local" is a private company but is a H&F rep, and stocks brands like Dormer, Guhring, Iscar, Mitutoyo, Hazzet etc. They also have brass, LG2 bronze, silver steel and plastics in stock.
My biggest problem here is getting anything more exotic than hot or cold rolled steel. I have been talking to Interlloy in Minto about shipping steel down and have found out they supply most of the engineering firms down here anyway.
Ew1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.
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30th May 2014, 12:44 PM #3
Yes it must depend on where you are in Australia. The southeast doesn't do too badly. But Graeme, your implicit point about ongoing de-industrialisation still holds. Closure of the car industry will probably see a ripple of closures right into the industrial supply sector. Apparently 6061 grade aluminium is only available in many sizes because of aerospace demand -- so with Qantas closing down, what effect will that have?
Ewan, I got a quote from Interlloy Minto and Bohler Wollongong just recently for machining steel in various flat, square and round sizes. Interlloy quote was $700, Bohler was $319, same specs. Jaw-dropping difference. There was no mistake, both quotes were itemised and discussed. Needless to say I was in Wollongong on Tuesday picking up my order, before driving up Sydney to pay a visit to Mick Moyle's second-hand tooling emporium.
Ian
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30th May 2014, 01:07 PM #4
I know what you mean about change. I live near Tamworth 280 miles north west of Sydney. When I moved here 39 years ago there was 2 large hardware stores to cater for the building and plumbing side and McPhersons as well as Engineers and Collieries- these guys supplied steel and tools to the engineers around the area. At about this time there was an established Bearing Service (a chain). Well the bearing seller had a couple of fellas who started their own bearing selling business.
Ok the present day....Mc Persons-gone, Engineer sand Collieries-gone, Bearing Service- gone. We now have Blackwoods, CBC and 3 other bearing sellers. The 2 fellas who kicked off their own bearing business- they have 3 stores in town, they sell bearings, bolts, belts......anything in the engineering field, H&F tools selling the same price as the catalogue price plus freight. They have gone from strength to strength and haven't looked back. Their secret....superdooper customer service. Whether you buy a hand full of bolts or or a workshop fit out for air tooling they look after you very well. McPhersons and E&C sold stuff but only in box full lots couldn't sell you one of anything. This is where the privateers picked up a lot. If a box was $50 and had 100 parts the privateers would open that box and sell you what ever you wanted and because they were selling small amounts that box may have yielded $120 to the company. You were happy because you didn't have to buy the box they were happy because they were making heaps. They also have a rep who will drop into farmers and associated shops in the whole northwest area. Lubricants are also in their arsenal
We also have Gasweld, Bunnings and probably 4 outlets that sell steel. Engineers stocks of steel can be had at the privateers shop and possibly Blackwoods (who still have the "box only" attitude. There are some big users in the district like coal miners and meat poultry who use them
In about 1980 I made a wood lathe but had to go to Sydney to buy lathe tools. No one in town kept them at all. Different story now there are a number of places that sell basic wood lathe tools but to get buy a complete range the sponsors in the Forum would be the best bet.
When I came here all that long ago (from Sydney) many times when wanting a particular item the response was "you want a what?". All in all Tamworth is not a bad place to buy stuff.Just do it!
Kind regards Rod
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30th May 2014, 01:13 PM #5Pink 10EE owner
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I find little low selling items are stocked in the regions these days because of the very efficient transport system we have that means small goods can be freighted anywhere in Australia overnight in the majority of cases...
Of course you pay for such a service..Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.
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30th May 2014, 01:48 PM #6SENIOR MEMBER
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30th May 2014, 05:03 PM #7
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30th May 2014, 07:18 PM #8future machinist
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I spend my weeks In Sydney but oddley enough I find it easier to get most of my engineering supplies in Nowra vs Sydney as the service is good and the price is slightly higher then in Sydney. One big plus is nice discounts like free steel I have been visiting these shops since I was 8
BETTER TO HAVE TOOLS YOU DON'T NEED THAN TO NEED TOOLS YOU DON'T HAVE
Andre
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30th May 2014, 07:43 PM #9Senior Member
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Im absolutely spoiled for choice here, when it comes to local retailers. The biggest of which is an engineering firm called Collier and Miller. There retail section is nearely as large as our local bunnies, but its very metal and agri business focussed. The steel sales section out the back is also that size again, and the engineering section is the size of metal and retail put together. There are 5 or 6 others, each with their own specialties like hydraulics, large turning (one firm in town has a 4m swing lathe, impressive beast to look at!) and so on. Getting odd bits of steel is really easy usually, most of the places go through 10k of steel a month if its quiet, there is always more trucks coming with more steel and one off orders can be chucked on the truck without any hassle. Dont even bother ordering if its 4140 or stainless of any flavour. The stuff grows on trees around here thanks to a pretty huge wine industry.
All that in a town of 22 000 people. Welcome to griffith
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30th May 2014, 11:57 PM #10
Seem to be able to pretty much buy whatever I need in metals here, but I generally dont need to chase anything specialised. With me its mainly ally extrusions and basic MS requirements, be it sheet, plate or RHS.
Blackwoods, well yeah never seem to have what I need on the shelf, so dont usually go there. Got a place here thats pretty good in the fasteners dept, dont stump em too often.
Its getting a lot harder here for me 2 dumpster dive here, my last contact for freeby steel offcuts is closing up at the end of the year. Great guillotine and press brake. Fingers crossed he just downsizes and moves the operation to his house.
Looks like I will have to be more inventive and find folks who are willing to trade services/goods like I do with my plumber.
Theres a few places I can easily buy offcuts, but its calculator out for even the smallest of bits. Certainally adds somewhat in project cost.
We have a place here that actually stocks some machinery (be it small lathes, mill drills, finger breaks from H&F) so its always an interesting place to visit.
Can obtain a few basics in the machining tools side of things locally at the industrial supplies joints. You know some milling cutters, but the range is pretty limited. Its a good couple of hours to my nearest machinery place in Melb, so need a pretty good excuse to make the trek. Ebay picks up the slack there.
We have pretty much lost our large factory base and have nothing to crow about here on the mining front. Odd thing is we have a few firms that seem to cater for mining, whether it be manufacture, equipment hire, service, overhall.www.lockwoodcanvas.com.au
I will never be the person who has everything, not when someone keeps inventing so much cool new stuff to buy.
From an early age my father taught me to wear welding gloves . "Its not to protect your hands son, its to put out the fire when u set yourself alight".
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31st May 2014, 08:32 AM #11SENIOR MEMBER
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I'm very lucky in Ballarat. We have the bearing place that stocks all things Mitutoyo and a massive range of tools of all quality, Total tools are here as well
Ballarat Industrial supplies have all the electric motors and VFD's, Thomas Warburton is the agent for Hare and Forbes, GB fasteners sell HSS and silver steel and cheap micrometers and dial indicators etc but funnily enough not much in the way of fasteners.
Ballarat Bolts and Fasteners sell one bolt at a time and have a massive range. I haven't caught them out yet.
Ballarat Mesh and Masonry have just started to stock disposable and refillable gas cylinders for MIG and TIG and all things welding. I won't even start on the motor rewinders.
Camerons steel will cut all the steel for free. Bright round mild steel they will cut off what you need above 1/2". (they stock both metric and imperial) You can also rummage through the offcuts bin.
Then there is the second hand metal joint that stocks, well, everything, including the occasional machine like the Brown and Sharpe surface grinder that was there a while back.
I can also get one off castings done at a reasonable price at Grigsby's Foundry.
The list goes on.
Phil
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31st May 2014, 08:42 AM #12Senior Member
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Yes...certainly harder!
20 years ago, Bohler had maraging steel in stock and a metallurgist on staff. Last I heard if I want some, 6 months advance order and buy a mill run from Austria, after they worked out what it was.
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31st May 2014, 02:26 PM #13Senior Member
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You guys don't know how lucky you are. I live in western NSW and the closest engineering supplier of any note is 400km round trip. Try and keep a good supply of mild steel/brass/alloy steels on hand so don't have to make a long trip for 6" of something. As for delivery forget it! Does tend to make you inventive and develop a make do mentality though. Do like the peace and quiet and wide open plains on the positive side
Mark
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31st May 2014, 07:43 PM #14Senior Member
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I use Interlloy and Bohler they are both within an hour of here
And then Brass and Copper, Stanton Rd Seven Hills for Brass and Copper of course
And for Stainless Steel Midway Metals at Erskine Park
Will
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6th June 2014, 09:16 AM #15Intermediate Member
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More difficult, some examples
trying to buy nickel bronze brazing rods from BOC " oh that's a specialised product" and here is me thinking that I have come to a specialised sort of shop
yesterday looking for acetal H " I don't know what sort of acetal we sell I will call you back, 3 hours later , we only have acetal C , we list acetal H ,but if you want any it's 30 meters minimum order, 4 weeks plus for delivery and you pay the freight "
Bohler closed down here in adelaide, interloy and global are still here but have minimum orders and some things they won't cut , have to buy a full length and may not have it in stock ,global were $200 minimum last time I asked
As R.C. Said with freight being more efficient no one stocks any thing any more and the sales staff seem clueless , computer says no etc
The proliferation of Chinese crap reduces the choice of what is available , different colour depending on the vendor but that's about it
but on a positive side with the internet and ebay etc things are available but I have to factor in postage and waiting , and yes I do buy Chinese equipment and with likes CTC etc I accept the quality as I am paying Chinese prices
Things are changing as to how business is done
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