Thread: Restoring a Weir boiler feed pump

I started to disassemble the water side of things tonight and I am even happier about the condition of things. Lots of rust but the working parts are looking pretty good.
I haven't measured the liner yet but I didn't see any great scarring with a quick visual.

The two suction valves are pressed in so until I make the special removal tool that is where they will stay.
DSC_1144.JPG DSC_1148.jpg

All the components in a valve set
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The underside of the valve chest cover
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These two came undone with relative ease and I don't know why
The top one is the liner retaining screw and the bottom one is the drain plug
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I also had a bit of a win with the side stays. I would almost say they fell out...almost
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Wondering, looking at the condition of them as to whether I should replace them or not.
I might give them a light skim and see how they turn out.
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Phil

Originally Posted by Steamwhisperer

I use the molasses and water to break down the rust. Not being a chemist, I wouldn't have a clue what the chemical reaction is that takes place but it sure does work.
I did another type of pump about 20 years ago and while I was picking this pump up the other weekend, it was sitting right next to it. The shed isn't lined or anything and stuff in there has been known to rust but there was no sign of rust anywhere on the pump. It certainly has stood the test of time . I also have a Furphy tank ends and fittings that were found in a swamp and well rusted. I did the fittings, pulled them out and the valve opened. Great stuff.

So it boils down to "'cos it works," huh? That's cool. I do a lot of things for similar reasons.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Handyjack

I have just come across this thread and have had a quick read of it.

I last operated a weir pump in December 2005 when the boilerhouse I was working in ceased operating. The boilerhouse only had weir pumps (3of) so it was regular practise to swap them around weekly. Over the years various repairs were carried out including reseating a valve nest. It was sad to see them scrapped when the boilerhouse was demolished, although the lubricators still exist and have been reused on other steam engines (one of which is at Lake Goldsmith).

I am trying to work out what size pump you are working on. The second smallest is 3 x 4 1/2 x 6 inch (Water cylinder diameter, steam cylinder diameter, stroke) if you do not count the horizontal junior Weir pump. I was under the impression that the piston and pump rod could be one piece for that size. In the boilerhouse above, the small Weir pump (5 x 7 x 12), had a combined piston and pump rod with the cross head attached, rather than two rods joined at the crosshead which was the practice on larger pumps.

With the makers number, what does the "B" stand for?

Looking forward to watching the rest of the rebuild.

Hi handyjack,
I have no idea how I missed your post last night. I'm on my phone at the moment with heaps to say in reply. Will get back tonight.

Phil

Originally Posted by Handyjack

I have just come across this thread and have had a quick read of it.

I last operated a weir pump in December 2005 when the boilerhouse I was working in ceased operating. The boilerhouse only had weir pumps (3of) so it was regular practise to swap them around weekly. Over the years various repairs were carried out including reseating a valve nest. It was sad to see them scrapped when the boilerhouse was demolished, although the lubricators still exist and have been reused on other steam engines (one of which is at Lake Goldsmith).

I am trying to work out what size pump you are working on. The second smallest is 3 x 4 1/2 x 6 inch (Water cylinder diameter, steam cylinder diameter, stroke) if you do not count the horizontal junior Weir pump. I was under the impression that the piston and pump rod could be one piece for that size. In the boilerhouse above, the small Weir pump (5 x 7 x 12), had a combined piston and pump rod with the cross head attached, rather than two rods joined at the crosshead which was the practice on larger pumps.

With the makers number, what does the "B" stand for?

Looking forward to watching the rest of the rebuild.

Hi Handyjack,
My pump is the 4" x 6" x 7" or third smallest simplex double acting they made and has the one piece piston rod. I was under the impression that the Weir pump became a two piece piston rod from a 9" cylinder upwards. The large Weir at work is an 8 1/2" x 6" x 18" and it has a two piece. I have no idea what made me think it was only pumps above 9". I do know you could order specials so maybe ours is one of those. I think mine might be straight out of the catalogue.
I have listed the number with a group of gentlemen who know all things about pump serial numbers so hopefully they can give me a bit of history to go with it.

Phil

Using "Weir" Working instructions publication 42/6 from May 1947, Standard Specification,
"Rod - For pumps 4" x 12" and under, in one piece of rolled naval brass; for Pumps 5" x 12", in one piece of stainless steel; for pumps 6" x 13" and upwards, in two pieces, viz.: Piston rod of mild steel, Pump Rod of stainless steel, joined by forged steel crosshead."

In the boilerhouse I last worked there were also two pumps of 6" x 8 1/2" x 18". On one of them the piston rod worked loose from the crosshead. The piston rod was replaced.
On another occasion I needed to tighten the nuts on the support stays.

When in service the boiler feedpumps were used and often abused. Maintenance was often minimal and in the case of the Weir pumps they very often just kept going until they either, stopped, fell apart, or stopped putting water in the boiler. No wonder they were found in so many boilerhouses.

Originally Posted by Handyjack

In the boilerhouse I last worked there were also two pumps of 6" x 8 1/2" x 18". On one of them the piston rod worked loose from the crosshead. The piston rod was replaced.
On another occasion I needed to tighten the nuts on the support stays.

When in service the boiler feedpumps were used and often abused. Maintenance was often minimal and in the case of the Weir pumps they very often just kept going until they either, stopped, fell apart, or stopped putting water in the boiler. No wonder they were found in so many boilerhouses.

Hi Handyjack,
one of our pumps has a habit of allowing one of the side stays to come loose as well. The last time, I gave it a 'good dose' of tightening and it seems to be ok. I can't understand why it came loose in the first place
though .
The ones at work rarely worked as they should and the general consensus was that they were always like that so I decided to do a couple of small repairs to at least get it up to a working standard.
The areas that needed attention were the bucket rings, there was only half of them left, the Auxilliary valve stem was bent and the shuttle valve wasn't anywhere near pushing up against the valve chest ports. The valves in the pump were probably 5 years overdue for a touch up as well
These things will keep running until they die. Oh by the way, these pumps are Welch Perrins. They made them under license from Weirs.

Bucket rings (or whats left of them)
IMG_2636.jpg IMG_2640.jpg

fitted with the new ones I machined out of horrendously expensive 'stuff'
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A pic of the before and after on the valves (they were all like this)
IMG_2436.jpgIMG_2437.jpg

Phil

I did a bit on the water side yesterday. I removed the rest of the studs and cleaned the sawdust and rust from the suction and discharge chambers.
The suction valves are proving to be a bit of a challenge even with the special puller made up to facilitate removal. Perhaps I might let them soak a little longer.
There are two plugs at the bottom of the pump. One I have loosened and the other...well, just aint comin' (it will though )
I would like to remove the pump liner before it gets the molasses treatment but that might just have to stay. After a good dose of looking at, I feel they are destroyed in the removal process as you would normally replace with new and there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with this one.

Pump internals and pump
DSC_1198.JPG DSC_1200.JPG DSC_1202.jpg

I cleaned the valve chest covers as well
DSC_1203.jpg DSC_1204.jpg DSC_1206.jpg DSC_1205.JPG

The piston rod
I finally got the crosshead off (ya don't reckon that took some doin' )
where the crosshead used to be
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the whole rod
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Water end
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Steam end
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There is a bit of scoring which isn't as bad as it looks. I am still undecided as to whether or not to replace the whole rod.
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I had planned to go to Lake Goldsmith today but after some impulse buying yesterday the funds are not available... so out to the shed again

Phil

The gentlemen who know things about the serial numbers on these pumps have got back to me and it seems my pump was made around 1939/40.
On their register they have a pump numbered in the 17000's made in 1939 and their next one is in the 36000's made in 1940. Thats doubling their numbers in 12 months! A lot of these pumps would have probably been manufactured for the navy as I think the corvettes had these pumps on board.
It is highly unlikely that my pump went through the '39 fires as it's previous owner had sawmills in the Acheron way in an area that was decimated. There has to be some explanation as to why there is no lagging and no makers plate and absolutely no sign of paint on it anywhere.
The investigation continues.
One of the engine drivers at work stays at my house three days a week and is a published sawmill historian who fortunately has done a history on Feiglins sawmills. I am reading through it at the moment.

Phil

Originally Posted by Steamwhisperer

I did a bit on the water side yesterday. I removed the rest of the studs and cleaned the sawdust and rust from the suction and discharge chambers.
The suction valves are proving to be a bit of a challenge even with the special puller made up to facilitate removal. Perhaps I might let them soak a little longer.
There are two plugs at the bottom of the pump. One I have loosened and the other...well, just aint comin' (it will though )
I would like to remove the pump liner before it gets the molasses treatment but that might just have to stay. After a good dose of looking at, I feel they are destroyed in the removal process as you would normally replace with new and there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with this one.

Pump internals and pump
DSC_1198.JPG DSC_1200.JPG DSC_1202.jpg

I cleaned the valve chest covers as well
DSC_1203.jpg DSC_1204.jpg DSC_1206.jpg DSC_1205.JPG

The piston rod
I finally got the crosshead off (ya don't reckon that took some doin' )
where the crosshead used to be
DSC_1230.JPG

the whole rod
DSC_1216.jpg

Water end
DSC_1227.JPG

Steam end
DSC_1226.JPG

There is a bit of scoring which isn't as bad as it looks. I am still undecided as to whether or not to replace the whole rod.
DSC_1228.JPG

I had planned to go to Lake Goldsmith today but after some impulse buying yesterday the funds are not available... so out to the shed again

Phil

Phil got a chunk of stainless rod here am willing to donate to the cause if you want. You got my c/p no is only a 45 min drive away.Me too no L goldsmith got to wait till november for a steam fix.Cheers John ps got no idea of grade for machine ability but should be ok .J,

Hi John,
thanks for the offer, I might just take you up on that. I haven't checked the fit of the tapers yet. If they are ok I might use the original, (my normal preferred choice) if not...
The scoring is minimal and there is very little undercut plus it fits in well with 'working clothes'.

Lazy day in the shed today, first up was to clean up a bit. I ran out of room to move.
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With that out of the way it was back into it. I gave the suction valves another go but they still wont budge. More soaking required
At about this time SWMBO came out to see what I was up to and offered some help so under guidance she fired up the 4" with the wire cup brush and set to on the externals of the water side
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While she was hard at work I decided to work on the throttle valve.
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I disassembled the valve and removed the studs for the stuffing box plus the remaining bonnet stud. To remove the spindle proved to be a challenge as the valve handle had to be removed but persistence prevailed and off it came.
It even has a 1/8" key on it . I cleaned the spindle valve head and ran a tap in the threaded stud holes to clean them out
A quick wire brush on the internals and externals and it was starting to look good. What a gem, it even has a badge with rivets cast into it with Weir on it with a recurring stamp that I can only assume is the quality control guys mark.
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I might make new studs as the stuffing box studs are badly wasted and one of the bonnet studs is missing. I will also clean and lap the seat and the valve head after that so I can assemble it and that will be finished
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I did a partial assembly to see what the side stays looked like as they were instead of bright shiny steel. It kinda' looks a bit more manly so considering its intended use I will give them a very vigorous wire brush and leave them as is. The brass work should exude a 'new age sensitive kinda guy' thing. Too much testosterone can't be all good
DSC_1255.jpg DSC_1256.jpg DSC_1257.jpg

Hopefully during the week I will get the studs finished.

Phil

Originally Posted by Steamwhisperer

I did a partial assembly to see what the side stays looked like as they were instead of bright shiny steel. It kinda' looks a bit more manly so considering its intended use I will give them a very vigorous wire brush and leave them as is. The brass work should exude a 'new age sensitive kinda guy' thing. Too much testosterone can't be all good

Nice work Phil, now that SWMBO has the wire-brush down pat, send her over here.. we've got plenty of work..

The trial assembly looks the goods, I like that you are going with the "steam punk" look, a bit of polished brass.

How is the parts count going, are you going to have to make many bits?

I think, at this stage we are only going to have to make some new bushes on the shaper rebuild. No other parts required (so far)..

Regards
Ray

Originally Posted by RayG

Nice work Phil, now that SWMBO has the wire-brush down pat, send her over here.. we've got plenty of work..

The trial assembly looks the goods, I like that you are going with the "steam punk" look, a bit of polished brass.

How is the parts count going, are you going to have to make many bits?

I think, at this stage we are only going to have to make some new bushes on the shaper rebuild. No other parts required (so far)..

Regards
Ray

Hi Ray,
I'll send her over, only problem is, she keeps finding her way home again
Only a couple of parts to make, a couple of studs plus the plunger type lubricator has the body but no plunger, gland nut, plug or outlet fitting. The steam chest drain is the same but it has the outlet fitting and of course rings for both the bucket and steam piston. The double joint is missing completely so that needs to be done from scratch and the auxilliary valve spindle is too far gone so a nice stainless one is gunna happen.
Considering the amount of rust and rubbish inside and out it's not too bad.
If a couple of new bushes are all the mighty Vanarmo needs you got a bargain

Phil

Hi Phil,
My senior commander says the only way SWMBO would be on the wire brush is to get you back into the house quicker! Mine has taken me away to the Sunshine Coast for a WHOLE WEEK!!! No shed for a WEEK. So I came back to your thread hoping to find some solace - but I feel jilted since you have not given us an update since 5thMay.

On the wust front, I had to make a bracket last week from steel from the junk - pretty wusty. Without wanting to be seen as 'harping' (just a bit prone sometiimes), I treated it with the good 'ole phosphoric and it passivated really well.

Regards, Daryl

Nice work Steamie,

Just thinking about all that rust ? How much of that is likely to be a build up of minerals outta the water ?

and um.............for doin such a nice job you can have a booby prize, if you want it