Thread: Scraping and Struggling.

Hi BT,

Have you tried turning the dividing head 180 and seeing if its close to the same center line or are you just going to mark one end of your new table and always set it up that way?
You could also remove and replace the dividing head and see how repeatable that is.
Of course you need repeatability in your measurments first. Did you try the other base yet?

Remember you aren't trying to measure a micron, you're trying to repeatably measure as close to nothing as you choose to get

Once you've made the spigot you can knock out as many bases as needed until you're happy(wont the bases be easy and cheap compared to the table?). Sure there may be better ways to fix the table to the base but not without using more height.

If you really get stuck you can paint my place as well

Stuart

Hello Stu,

I've been enduring the discomfort of the heat in the shed achieving not much other than confirming Michael's comments relating to repeatability outside of the controlled toolroom environment. Using a 0.01mm indicator reveals a lateral spindle displacement on the x axis of 0.01mm. I have been indicating off the more managable tailstock spindle. I will graduate to the headstock after lunch. I have it set up with a collet and endmill that show no discernable run out when the spindle is rotated. I have to see whether I can position the indicator such that it will allow end for end readings.

BT

Hi BT,

I can't offer any helpful suggestions ( I like Stuart's idea of reversing though) but I can offer some encouragement, often it's patience and determination that wins through, and you obviously have both of those in spades.

For what you are doing you don't need to do absolute measurements in the micron range, making relative measurements in the micron range is a different issue altogether, and much more achievable.

Making setup stuff, like vises, parallels, squares, angle plates, etc, etc, you really do like those things to be an order of magnitude more accurate than the job requires, simply because those errors can accumulate, sometimes if you are lucky they can cancel as well.

So, hang in there, the painting will wait.

Regards
Ray

OK Boys.

I've spent the last warm hour toing and froing the dividing head on my base and the lateral centerline displacement is no more than 0.0002" or 0.005mm. The Millimess is too sensitive to be of any practical use.

With a 0.0001" dial indicator set up fairly square to the centerline of the DH spindle, the repeatability is within 0.0001" or 0.0025mm. There is 0.0001" runout in the collet / endmill setup and I'm indicating for repeatability at the midpoint of the runout. Repeatability is based an removal and replacement of the dividing head on the base.

I think I should be able to position the vertical spindle fairly accurately off the tenth indicator simply by elevating and traversing the table then carefully zeroing the indicator with the same endmill held in a chuck. The table does not move on the Y axis. Sounds easy.

The lateral displacement is what you can see in the second photo showing the yellow 0.01mm indicator, the needle is slightly left of zero.

How's the beautiful tiny Federal tenth indicator. A generous gift from fellow forum member "C-47". Thank you Alan.

BT

Originally Posted by Anorak Bob

OK Boys.

I've spent the last warm hour toing and froing the dividing head on my base and the lateral centerline displacement is no more than 0.0002" or 0.005mm. The Millimess is too sensitive to be of any practical use.

With a 0.0001" dial indicator set up fairly square to the centerline of the DH spindle, the repeatability is within 0.0001" or 0.0025mm. There is 0.0001" runout in the collet / endmill setup and I'm indicating for repeatability at the midpoint of the runout. Repeatability is based an removal and replacement of the dividing head on the base.

I think I should be able to position the vertical spindle fairly accurately off the tenth indicator simply by elevating and traversing the table then carefully zeroing the indicator with the same endmill held in a chuck. The table does not move on the Y axis. Sounds easy.

The lateral displacement is what you can see in the second photo showing the yellow 0.01mm indicator, the needle is slightly left of zero.

How's the beautiful tiny Federal tenth indicator. A generous gift from fellow forum member "C-47". Thank you Alan.

BT

Bob
Persistance is paying off.
Looks like beautiful work being undertaken.
Indirectly you have contributed to my 12 yr old grandson who whilst visiting us has been looking over my shoulder, while I communicate on this Forum, particularly with you.
He has told me he is going back home to Grafton (8 hrs drive north from here) to set up a "neat" workshop, & wants to join the forum. He proposes to start off with wood projects. I built his father a solid workbench with vises etc fitted so he is off to a good start.
regards
Bruce
ps I only have 1/2 thou indicators,So I better come up to speed & get a 1/10th thou indicator.

Bob,
Glad the indicator has turned out to be of some use and keep up the good work. Alan.

Go Bob!

"drill drill drill" or should that be "bore bore bore"?

How you have that all well in hand.
The dial gauge stand holding the 0.0001" dail gauge, whats going on inside the vertical post?(at the bottom of the screw slot)

Stuart

Originally Posted by Stustoys

"drill drill drill" or should that be "bore bore bore"?

How you have that all well in hand.
The dial gauge stand holding the 0.0001" dail gauge, whats going on inside the vertical post?(at the bottom of the screw slot)

Stuart

Stu,

I just slipped up to the shed to look at the two small ridges in the screw slot. Dismantling the thing would lead to mutilation and tears. I have no idea why they are there. The shaft is screwed to the base securely, too securely for me to remove.

I'ts a really neat indicator stand, one of my earliest Ebay purchases. Eclipse made an even heavier version of that stand as did Baty and Mercer. I used to look for one but they are heavy suggesting potentially high shipping costs. Far more rigid than the Noga but lacking the flexibility.

BT

HI BT,
So it does look like a separate part then.....strange. still I'm sure they had their reasons.
I've used the Eclipse one that looks to be about the same size as yours, the fine adjustment is way better than any of the ones I have used that are out on the end near the gauge.

Stuart

Stu,

I have a few Starrett and Eclipse mag stands without adjusters and they a bit of a pain to use. I also have a Starrett with the snake arm and fine adjustment but it is a bit unweildy to use on a regular basis. The Noga is my go to stand. You need one.

BT

All this for one lousy hole!

I about with a few ideas for setting the dial indicator on the centerline of the horizontal spindle. Above or below the centerline and I may as well be using a wooden rule for the job.
Dawned on me after wasting an hour or so that I needed to be able to move the indicator vertically over the test bar ( 10mm slot drill ) to fairly accurately establish the centerline.The solution was a bit Heathish but worked. I set the indicator up so that it was zeroed at the midpoint of the 2 tenths test bar runout. The same test bar set up in a collet chuck indicated double the runout so I split the difference and moved the vertical spindle into position after traversing the table to determine the vertical centerline of the test bar. Started the hole with a slot drill and finished off with power feed on the slowest setting. The hole is 10.22mm in diameter, I was aiming for 10 but trying to set the boring head to cut to a finished size proved to be too large a challenge for me.

The hole size doesn't matter, more of a concern was making sure the shaft of the boring bar didn't collide with the tee slot sides. I will clean up the ends of the base and then move over to the lathe.

I do apologize for this painful odyssey but if only one other person has learned something from my efforts then it has been worthwhile.

BT

Hi BT,
Nicely done.
Now onwards to the lathe.

Stuart

Always interesting Bob, & one never stops learning, that is the enjoyment.
regards
Bruce