Thread: New shed. Buy or build

Hi Phil
Out of left field, have you thought about either portable offices or even portable classrooms. Put in a concrete floor and youre done.

Roger

Hi Phil,

First let me congratulate you on getting things sorted and becoming a home owner.

With regard to sheds ! When I decided that the wooden hut was no longer a place that I wanted to play about in, I wanted to replace it with as big a workshop as I could get in the space that I had available to me. 22 feet by 12 feet. I know, small from what I read you guys have. Anyway I went with a sectional concrete building on a 150 mm concrete pad on top of 150 mm of compacted hardcore with a sisqueen water barrier between. Because the concrete sections are 460 mm wide by 1830 long it meant that I could choose how big a building I wanted and where doors and windows went. I chose not to have any windows, purely from a security point of view. The only additional costs were when it came to the roof ! Again I had the choice of slope direction and roof material.

I did all the internal fitting out including insulation and wiring. My only letdown is the internal roof height. Shortly after the workshop was completed I was offered a Bridgeport mill for £300. All I had to do was take it away.

It turned out that it was more cost effective to let the sectional building manufacturer to lay the foundations and erect the building including the corrugated concrete roof. The only work that I did was to lay ducting for the electricity supply. I've have this workshop for 4 years now and would hate to pay todays prices for what I have. All in I paid £3120 inc vat.

So it may be worth considering a sectional building that you can expand if you need to. By the way here in the UK, my garage is permitted development so I didn't need any consents.

Originally Posted by BaronJ

Hi Phil,

First let me congratulate you on getting things sorted and becoming a home owner.

With regard to sheds ! When I decided that the wooden hut was no longer a place that I wanted to play about in, I wanted to replace it with as big a workshop as I could get in the space that I had available to me. 22 feet by 12 feet. I know, small from what I read you guys have. Anyway I went with a sectional concrete building on a 150 mm concrete pad on top of 150 mm of compacted hardcore with a sisqueen water barrier between. Because the concrete sections are 460 mm wide by 1830 long it meant that I could choose how big a building I wanted and where doors and windows went. I chose not to have any windows, purely from a security point of view. The only additional costs were when it came to the roof ! Again I had the choice of slope direction and roof material.

I did all the internal fitting out including insulation and wiring. My only letdown is the internal roof height. Shortly after the workshop was completed I was offered a Bridgeport mill for £300. All I had to do was take it away.

It turned out that it was more cost effective to let the sectional building manufacturer to lay the foundations and erect the building including the corrugated concrete roof. The only work that I did was to lay ducting for the electricity supply. I've have this workshop for 4 years now and would hate to pay todays prices for what I have. All in I paid £3120 inc vat.

So it may be worth considering a sectional building that you can expand if you need to. By the way here in the UK, my garage is permitted development so I didn't need any consents.

Baron J

I think you are describing a technique we refer to as "tilt-up."

Regards
Paul

Hi Paul (Bushmiller),
great post, great information.
I'll try and answer as good as you have asked.
As much as I would love to be able to work in wood, I just plain can't . Everything I do is in metal, stuff like this. https://www.woodworkforums.com/169841...ight=weir+pump
At times the stuff can be large, possibly too large for a container though and possibly a shed as well.
There is plenty of room on the block with great access plus it is really quite flat. the shire don't require any permits for containers, they just need it not to be seen from the road.
Not sure if you have spent a winter in Ballarat, two mornings ago it was -2.3 deg.. The next morning it was 7. The winters here are quite famous. It also can get blistering hot here in summer as well.
Work lighting somehow seems to be better for me by being artficial but then thinking about it I haven't really done much work in natural light.
What you are doing with your containers is what I had in mind. I see what you mean about the costs and time involved to get it up to what I may need and seeing my budget pretty much falls just short of zero. I am after as much bang for my buck as I can get.
Great idea about sitting the container on pads instead of a slab. I reckon even I could do that.
You have given me food for thought Paul and have helped heaps.

Hi Ray,
I love the idea of the classrooms, plenty of light, not sure how strong the floor would be though. My little Douglas shaper has a lot of weight on a small footprint. It's not entirely impossible though.

Hi Shed,
I will look at clear span. I had figured on fitting a travelling gantry with a custom built humpback beam which would be far less restrictive with the clear span.
The trusses I may make are RHS or SHS I have done a fair bit of work like this and with strategic welding I use the next weld etc. to pull things back into alignment. It is actually easier to weld something straight or square than not now.
Heaps of practice though.

Hi th62,
I'm thinking of a container for steel storage now and perhaps a bucket or two of dessicant. I kinda' wish I could do woodwork but as hard as I try it always turns into the best firewood available

Hi Richard (.RC.)
you made me giggle when I read your post (#31). When we were inspecting the house I walked past a small garden shed he had there and imagined a small lump of rock in there and fully temperature controlled atmosphere.

Hi Roger,
Ray (wheelinround) has already thrown that one into the ring. Great minds....

Hi Baron,
Thanks for the congrats,
now you have given me a whole new line of thinking. We have a place in Ballarat that does this kind of thing. I will investigate further.

Many thanks again guys, I'm learning heaps here.

Phil

Phil the classroom idea was more for pre-fab frame floor joists could be cut away while side frame secured around perimeter of a concrete floor.


Gone are the days where a few old telegraph poles would construct a damn good shed which would last a few sheets of gal roofing and walls

Originally Posted by wheelinround

Phil the classroom idea was more for pre-fab frame floor joists could be cut away while side frame secured around perimeter of a concrete floor.


Gone are the days where a few old telegraph poles would construct a damn good shed which would last a few sheets of gal roofing and walls

haha...........I did my last shed like that
all the gurts, purlins and corrugated iron came from a shed that i stripped at the old Ferntree Gully slaughter house, i think it cost 300 bucks. The poles i got from a bloke that replacted poles for a power company, he also provided me with many more that i cut up and used for fencing, the cost was a couple of chainsaw rebuilds and a brush cutter repair

poles.jpg

There is a lot to be said buying a place with a shed on it.... and "tweeking" it a bit. Or at least a decent carport and filling it in with walls

Had casual thoughts of getting a single bay truss assembly (including columns and footings) "engineered" and going from there.

Originally Posted by wheelinround

Phil the classroom idea was more for pre-fab frame floor joists could be cut away while side frame secured around perimeter of a concrete floor.


Gone are the days where a few old telegraph poles would construct a damn good shed which would last a few sheets of gal roofing and walls

Hi Ray,
I'm almost too embarrassed to say that I wouldn't have thought of taking the floor out and just attaching the perimeter and if I used the appropriate anchors that would suit whatever wind rating etc., it would make a great shed.
I have never dealt with this shire yet and it may be so left of centre that they put it into the 'too hard basket'.
Then again, maybe the guys at Nungaron have done it before. Definitly worth looking into.

Phil

Hi Phil
Congrats on the house.
Containers must be cheap down there, up here it cost about 2K each for a standard 20' in reasonable condition. By the time you get a couple you may as well buy the kit!

These kits don't contain anything fancy. actually mine was bloody flimsy until i had the bracing and sheets on. It would be pretty easy to copy if needed, and much cheaper i'm sure.

There is always 2nd hand iron, RHS etc to keep the cost down. I think the worst bit will be the slab. Can't reeally use 2nd hand concrete......

Ew

Originally Posted by Ueee

Hi Phil
Congrats on the house.
Containers must be cheap down there, up here it cost about 2K each for a standard 20' in reasonable condition. By the time you get a couple you may as well buy the kit!

These kits don't contain anything fancy. actually mine was bloody flimsy until i had the bracing and sheets on. It would be pretty easy to copy if needed, and much cheaper i'm sure.

There is always 2nd hand iron, RHS etc to keep the cost down. I think the worst bit will be the slab. Can't reeally use 2nd hand concrete......

Ew

You can use 2nd hand concrete on a farm. I keep my eyes open for it. I bought home about 4 tonne in 6 slabs a couple of years ago. Those with stock will know about the areas around water troughs etc. I used them upside down for grip. I have been thinking about some small bits to fill some holes under fences created by hoppy wildlife.

Ok, you can't use it for a shed floor.

Dean

Of course, the next question is do you really need a concrete floor?
If you put in concrete pads for machines, the space in between could be anything - get some joists and throw down a wooden floor (second hand flooring or yellow tongue). Hard pack the dirt and put down some pavers or concrete squares. In a cold climate having an air gap under a wooden floor may be a better move as the cold won't travel through your feet. Nicer to stand on too.
Doesn't have to be permanent and if you need another pad then cut a hole...

Michael

Originally Posted by Michael G

Of course, the next question is do you really need a concrete floor?

The answer to that, in no uncertain terms is, yes, you most definitely do need a concrete floor, or something with equivalent load bearing and point load capacity. PDW

Originally Posted by PDW

The answer to that, in no uncertain terms is, yes, you most definitely do need a concrete floor, or something with equivalent load bearing and point load capacity. PDW

I agree that you need something, but the expensive bit seems to be the concrete - hence the suggestion of (concrete) pads for the machines but something else between them. I worked in an ex-munitions plant once and that was how it was done there - pads for the machines plus floor boards between for people to drop things on...

Michael

I like the idea of concrete pads and perhaps flooring (wooden) or some such thing.
A couple of reasons.
My legs and feet and hurt like all get out if I stand on concrete now for prolonged periods. I suppose I could get a chair and I already have a rubber mat for the lathe
Certainly cheaper and it is something I could easily do my self.
I will be restricted to leaving the lathe in that spot but I generally don't move 'the furniture' so to speak all that often and now I don't have to move it ever again .

Phil