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  1. #1
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    Default Type A and Type B assets - Grays online

    Hi all,

    Been looking at a few surface grinders recently, particularly Grays online. One thing that puzzles me are their asset categories. They have type A and type B assets.

    As follows:


    • The area is defined as a work site and in accordance with the requirements of the VIC OH&S Act 2004, site removal activities must be conducted on a safe manner. In order to manage and minimise site risks. The assets have been categorized into type A or B Assets

    Type "A" assets are low risk & are to be removed by the purchaser with Grays staff supervision and are to be collected on Thursday 2nd & Friday 3rd October 2014 between 9.00am and 4.00pm.
    Type "B" assets are high risk and the site activities must be in accordance with the attached contractor procedures and are to be collected on Thursday 2nd & Friday 3rd October 2014 between 9.00am and 4.00pm.
    Type "B" assets are high risk and the site activities must be in accordance with Graysonline contractor procedures and are to be collected by appointment with a qualified contractor. JSAs and contractor requirements forms are to be submitted before work is started on site.

    Now, given that I have been watching SG on Grays for a few months now, I have noticed that until now, they have all been type A assets, even the monstrous grinders that I have no interest in. I then come acoss a nice J&S 540P and it's listed as a type B asset. What the? It's not exactly the biggest SG out there!

    Anyway, here's the add. I know there is a specific thread for auctions but this is not intended as an auction notification but more an attempt to get more info from anyone who has been the winning bidder on a type B asset and whether it's a complicated and expensive a task as it seems.

    http://www.graysonline.com/lot/0004-...ipman?spr=true


    What also puzzles me is when they say this in the information:

    Note: Carb-I-Tool can skate to front of building - purchaser will need to provide a crane truck to transport.

    How can they "skate" it to the front of the building if it's such a high risk item to move? I was kinda oping they can just "skate" it to the front of the building and I'll lift it onto my trailer with a hand operated engine crane. Looks like that would be a no no!

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

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  3. #2
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    G'day Simon,
    I made enquiries to Grays regarding this a while back, I think the type B blurb is fairly open. You can send them a JSA/ WMS that you make up yourself, i.e. Item to be removed using appropriate means, all staff involved will have appropriate safety gear. If the ad mentions Carbitool will skate to front I recon you are ok, I am going there tomorrow, I can see if I can get a contact from the site.
    Bruce

  4. #3
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    Hi Simon,

    You're lucky my shed is full

    Just how much do you think that thing weighs?

    PM sent(well shortly lol)

    Stuart

  5. #4
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    They are not very heavy, 700kg maybe....

    One thing you have to bevery wary of with them is the hydraulic tank is in the base and is not a closed unit.... I had to move mine about 300km to get it home... The back of the car was full of oil by the time I got home..
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  6. #5
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    Pick up and moving of heavy precision machinery needs planning and preparation... You will need a forklift or crane truck to load and unload, 700 kg is not really engine crane territory...

    You might have to fill in a JSA, but they are pretty straight forward as a rule.. Just don't cut corners and make sure you have all the bases covered. See if you can get a manual on-line that will tell you the lifting points, make sure you have plenty of load binders, dunnage and straps. If you sling it, you might need a spreader.. Phil can probably give you chapter and verse on correct ways to sling precision machines.

    One other thing with surface grinders, is to check how the table is mounted especially check if it's on ball bearings, as sudden shocks can brinell the ways. Block it up and make sure it can't move in transit if that's the case.
    Nearly all Grays auctions are a hive of activity on collection day, and there is often a forklift driver who will do you a favour if you ask nicely.


    Ray

    PS http://seeforge.com/5-steps-when-conducting-a-jsajha/

  7. #6
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    Thanks guys. I figured it was so that it anyone was injured that Grays have something in writing to cover them.

    Hi Bruce, I was hoping you are correct. I can fill out that OH&S stuff and tell them what they want to hear. Only thing is I don't have any insurance other than on my motor vehicle.
    Stuart, I know you are a fan of J&S grinders! I'm surprised you weren't already all over it! I thought you would always have room for a J&S!

    RC, I figured between 700 and 800Kg from my basic research I have done. I had also read that the hydraulic oil can spill everywhere if not careful. Lifting is supposed to be done using the two eyelets at the top in conjunction with the two on each side just below the table. They all show up on the pics except there seems to be one missing on the LHS top.

    Wait and see what happens. I suspect it will go for more than I care to pay. Also, the pick up dates are not very convenient either. I'll be away from Tuesday to Friday this week on a family outing. I may make it home in time on Friday but I can't guarantee it. They seem pretty well inflexible with the pick up dates, which I found out when I bid on a Nagase SG in Sydney. Glad I didn't win that one! Maybe I could get them to skate it out onto the naturestrip and just leave it there for me to pick up A/H?

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayG View Post
    Pick up and moving of heavy precision machinery needs planning and preparation... You will need a forklift or crane truck to load and unload, 700 kg is not really engine crane territory...

    You might have to fill in a JSA, but they are pretty straight forward as a rule.. Just don't cut corners and make sure you have all the bases covered. See if you can get a manual on-line that will tell you the lifting points, make sure you have plenty of load binders, dunnage and straps. If you sling it, you might need a spreader.. Phil can probably give you chapter and verse on correct ways to sling precision machines.

    One other thing with surface grinders, is to check how the table is mounted especially check if it's on ball bearings, as sudden shocks can brinell the ways. Block it up and make sure it can't move in transit if that's the case.
    Nearly all Grays auctions are a hive of activity on collection day, and there is often a forklift driver who will do you a favour if you ask nicely.


    Ray

    PS http://seeforge.com/5-steps-when-conducting-a-jsajha/
    Thanks Ray. Yea 700 Kg is getting on the heavy side for an engine crane although I did mange to lift my Macson 18" shaper off the trailer with mine which I thought weighed more than 700Kg.

    I would also plan on removing the table for the exact reason you mention. If I can't remove the table then perhaps some 10mm timber spacers to lift it off slightly.

    Anyway, it all seems a bit too hard to organise ATM since I'll be away. I'll see, these things always seem to come up at the most inopportune times!

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post
    Stuart, I know you are a fan of J&S grinders! I'm surprised you weren't already all over it! I thought you would always have room for a J&S!
    I would be..... but I really have run out of space, in fact I'd run out of space before I bought my last machine

    Stuart

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonl View Post

    I would also plan on removing the table for the exact reason you mention. If I can't remove the table then perhaps some 10mm timber spacers to lift it off slightly.
    No need to do that, it runs on plain slides... You cannot just "lift" the table, you will bend the hydraulic ram rods..

    I did read somewhere that on some models the saddle axis ran on balls, but that person may have been dreaming as mine is cast on cast slides all the way...
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  11. #10
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    Hi Simon,
    ours was moved by professional machine tool movers and all they did was lower the head down on to a block of wood sitting on the magnetic chuck with just enough pressure to stop the table from moving.
    It all seems ok.

    Phil

  12. #11
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    Thanks Phil & RC.

    RC, I was planning on disassembling the table with a tool kit but looks like that won't be needed either way. Phil, using the head to "clamp" the table sounds like a very practical idea. Probably use an abundance of rachet tie downs too.
    I think I will most likely have to let this go anyway. It turns out that I'll be away till Saturday NOT Friday as first thought. I had put a bid on it but since been outbid (luckily) I also have a bid on an Elliot 8-18 SG in Sydney, it prefer a J&S but anyway. The Elliot has pick up dates that run into the next week so gives me a little more time to organise. That auction finishes 40 mms before the J&S auction so I may make some enquiries about how "flexible" the pickup dates are.

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  13. #12
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    I wouldnot be too cut up about missing out on a J&S grinder...

    They are good grinders within their envelope, but there are far better designs out there.. They are way over rated IMO.. I put them in the same category as Colchester lathes... Very popular more because they were built to a price rather then a standard....

    Still I like mine and it does what I ask of it... But it is not a Blohm..
    Light red, the colour of choice for the discerning man.

  14. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by .RC. View Post
    I wouldnot be too cut up about missing out on a J&S grinder...

    They are good grinders within their envelope, but there are far better designs out there.. They are way over rated IMO.. I put them in the same category as Colchester lathes... Very popular more because they were built to a price rather then a standard....

    Still I like mine and it does what I ask of it... But it is not a Blohm..
    Ha! I've never owned one so I can only be guided by what I have read. Oh, also Stuart once told me that J&S are the ONLY manufacturers of SG, the rest just try! How could I argue with that!

    As for a Blohm, well I would scoff at seeing a learner in a Maserati so me owning a Blohm would have to be of a similar TOOL factor!

    One needs to be realistic when it comes to machine quality and capability and see that there is some correlation between that and the skills of the person using them!
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

  15. #14
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    I'd be looking out for a reasonable Okamoto, Sure Blohm is nice, ask Ewan, he has one. But you'd be very unlikely to find one. Okamoto, should be easier to find a good one.

    Or if you'd like a TOS Surface Grinder....Rich River Dealers have one, last person I sent up there, came away with a Hardinge HLV

    Sorry, too late it sold already for $600 http://www.graysonline.com/lot/0031-3007371

    Ray

  16. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayG View Post
    I'd be looking out for a reasonable Okamoto, Sure Blohm is nice, ask Ewan, he has one. But you'd be very unlikely to find one. Okamoto, should be easier to find a good one.

    Or if you'd like a TOS Surface Grinder....Rich River Dealers have one, last person I sent up there, came away with a Hardinge HLV

    Sorry, too late it sold already for $600 http://www.graysonline.com/lot/0031-3007371

    Ray
    I had been watching that one too. In all honesty it is ridiculously too too big for my needs. Also the front panel hanging off with all the electrics exposed had me wonderings why it's like that. Another factor, I can't bring myself to own a machine tool called TOS! My wife would never let mew live it down. A TOS for a Tosser I can se her saying….

    There are a couple of Okamoto SG for sale a while back. Was unsure about them and their size. These machine tools seem to grow in size when you put them in your shed!

    Simon
    Girl, I don't wanna know about your mild-mannered alter ego or anything like that." I mean, you tell me you're, uh, super-mega-ultra-lightning babe? That's all right with me. I'm good. I'm good.

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