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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayG View Post
    I think you meant Stuart.
    I don't care who it is!

    But, ok. Muffed again. It has been quite a while since we have seen evidence of these "powers". Time for another display I think.

    I should just get out of bed and have a look myself.

    Dean

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  3. #47
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    How many insulating sleeves am I likely to find in total. I have counted 10 so far. Thats all I have found. 12?

    Motor Windings 4.jpg

    There is one connection I have found so far. Where the arrow is, but behind the visible sleeve. It can only be seen with the use of a small mirror. I am now wishing I had an even smaller one.

    Dean

  4. #48
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    Dean, you need to find the one with 3 wires, possibly 2 going into the sleeve from one end and 1 from the other end of the sleeve like this.


  5. #49
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    Techo, I do understand that, but I cannot see what is invisible. All of the windings are well inside the casing which limits sight angles, hence the wish for a smaller mirror.

    I have made a mirror about 8mm x 10mm on a handle bent at about 45 deg. The mirror was cut from a HDD platter. This is a vast improvement but is still a bit big in places (the raised parts on inside of casting). However this is as small as I think is usable for my older eyes.

    I am using a headband magnifier.

    I have carefully examined the entire end of the windings. My position has not changed. 10(?) insulating sleeves plus the 3 I have already released, which I did not point out before. One connection with 3 wires as pointed out in the picture.

    The only options I have now are to either press out the stator after removing the welds, or release the sleeves from the varnish to enable a better view behind.

    I am going to do something else for a while and ponder this. Maybe I should look at a different motor for a change. Is the big old clunker from the Nuttall likely to be a possble contender or should I forget it. It is 3Hp and rather bulky. It would suit the era of the shaper quite nicely.

    Dean

  6. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayG View Post
    I think you meant Stuart.
    For the record I was thinking the one between Joes arrows....... but I wouldnt bet $1 on it

    Stuart

  7. #51
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    OK Dean, if you can't see the one with three wires going in, release the one in front of it and carefully move it out of the way. Once you find the one with three wires going in, release that oo and slice the sleeve open to confirm the connection inside. You'll just go "Eureka!" and get on with cutting it and splicing new cables to them....
    Cheers,
    Joe
    9"thicknesser/planer, 12" bench saw, 2Hp Dusty, 5/8" Drill press, 10" Makita drop saw, 2Hp Makita outer, the usual power tools and carpentry hand tools...

  8. #52
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    Ok. For some reason I was thinking I need to find 3 connections. I just visualised one of the many diagrams I found or received while trying to work out the lathe motor connection, and realised it was 3 wires to one connection. Sigh.

    What is the latest thoughts on what is needed to bring out these wires. According to what I was told by the local motor rewinder, almost any cord is suitable. I do need some spray to stick it all back down again. That leaves the wire and spagetti. As the motor does not need to be baked, will ordinary wire work, as well as normal spagetti?

    I retreived the other 2 motors mentioned previously, today. There is a 1Hp Wye connection made by Pope and a 3Hp Delta connection made by Crompton Parkinson. At least I know what I am dealing with. The drill motor plate says virtually nothing useful.

    Dean

  9. #53
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    Use a two part epoxy (like Araldite) to stick it all down - not spray. I'd use silicone insulated wires and fireglass spagetti tuing (all better for a bit of motor heat in the longer term.
    Cheers,
    Joe
    9"thicknesser/planer, 12" bench saw, 2Hp Dusty, 5/8" Drill press, 10" Makita drop saw, 2Hp Makita outer, the usual power tools and carpentry hand tools...

  10. #54
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    Ok Joe.

    One thing I found interesting is the material used to hold the windings in the slot.

    Packing Material.jpg

    This picture is just a selection cut from an existing picture so will not be all that good. It looks to me like cane. The type of cane used to make furniture etc. I scraped the end of a bit with my pocket knife today and it acted like cane. As you can see it looks very porous. Considering the age of this motor I don't think it is some high tech low density polymer. A low tech polymer? Intriguing.

    Dean

  11. #55
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    Ueee is offline Blacksmith, Cabinetmaker, Machinist, Messmaker
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    Hi Dean,
    The 2hp motor on my Hercus drill press has similar materials. Only it is definitely a timber "dowel" not cane. I would have thought with the heat shrinkage might be an issue but it seems not.

    Ew
    1915 17"x50" LeBlond heavy duty Lathe, 24" Queen city shaper, 1970's G Vernier FV.3.TO Universal Mill, 1958 Blohm HFS 6 surface grinder, 1942 Rivett 715 Lathe, 14"x40" Antrac Lathe, Startrite H225 Bandsaw, 1949 Hercus Camelback Drill press, 1947 Holbrook C10 Lathe.

  12. #56
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    Some time back, in another thread, I said I was going to get a Megger. I did finally get around to ordering it and it turned up yesterday. Another item that arrived was a replacement hand held tacho. I bought one to help with checking speeds on the lathe, using the VFD. It worked for a few days then the laser stopped working. The seller offered to send a replacement. The problem was that a couple of days ago I checked all my EBay purchases to see what was going on. (I have 2 hemostats that are about 8 weeks overdue from China. $2.86 down the drain.) I found the message from the Tacho seller offering a replacement, but I could not find my reply. Oops. Immediate reply sent with appologies. A couple of days later and it arrived. Last night, when unpacking I got them mixed up. The one with the battery is the old one! But it works? Swap batteries and this one also works. A comparison of the two (you would have to do this wouldn't you?) showed them to be virtually identical just by eye. A picture would freeze the action. So they are both showing the same result. Whether this is an accurate result?

    Anyway, the real reason for this post is that the Megger came with a reasonable looking set of instructions, but only in Chinese.

    Megger.jpg

    Could someone please give me a quick rundown on it? Normally I would play, but in this case I am heeding the warnings given. I have not even unwrapped the leads yet.

    Dean

  13. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldneweng View Post
    Some time back, in another thread, I said I was going to get a Megger. I did finally get around to ordering it and it turned up yesterday. Another item that arrived was a replacement hand held tacho. I bought one to help with checking speeds on the lathe, using the VFD. It worked for a few days then the laser stopped working. The seller offered to send a replacement. The problem was that a couple of days ago I checked all my EBay purchases to see what was going on. (I have 2 hemostats that are about 8 weeks overdue from China. $2.86 down the drain.) I found the message from the Tacho seller offering a replacement, but I could not find my reply. Oops. Immediate reply sent with appologies. A couple of days later and it arrived. Last night, when unpacking I got them mixed up. The one with the battery is the old one! But it works? Swap batteries and this one also works. A comparison of the two (you would have to do this wouldn't you?) showed them to be virtually identical just by eye. A picture would freeze the action. So they are both showing the same result. Whether this is an accurate result?

    Anyway, the real reason for this post is that the Megger came with a reasonable looking set of instructions, but only in Chinese.

    Megger.jpg

    Could someone please give me a quick rundown on it? Normally I would play, but in this case I am heeding the warnings given. I have not even unwrapped the leads yet.

    Dean

    I have no idea why they have two sets voltage scales...normally they only have one set of voltage scales ie 240, 500, 1000 with a couple low resistance scales.

    I would play with it...dont use it on yourself...they dont hurt....... much...not too much trust me

    As for testing insulation resistance i have used a cindered match or spittle wiped across a piece of timber..it is not an accuracy test by anymeans, but is indictative of if the thing is working or not....and of course dont use it on anything electronic.

    a dead short ( connetct leads together together) will give a reading...apart should not show, and spittle or cindered match some where in between

    the infinity symbol says all is ok at 240 and 500....generally one does not need to use 1000V...I use 500v for everything ie on 240v and 500v motors

    any thing less than say 10mohm may need further checking or anylisis with below 1 not acceptable...above 10 everyhting should be ok
    ( i think I have that right)...I use an analogue meggar and have become accustomed to just reading the location of the needle on the scale and dont actually notice the reading)

  14. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by eskimo View Post
    I have no idea why they have two sets voltage scales...normally they only have one set of voltage scales ie 240, 500, 1000 with a couple low resistance scales.

    I would play with it...dont use it on yourself...they dont hurt....... much...not too much trust me

    As for testing insulation resistance i have used a cindered match or spittle wiped across a piece of timber..it is not an accuracy test by anymeans, but is indictative of if the thing is working or not....and of course dont use it on anything electronic.

    a dead short ( connetct leads together together) will give a reading...apart should not show, and spittle or cindered match some where in between

    the infinity symbol says all is ok at 240 and 500....generally one does not need to use 1000V...I use 500v for everything ie on 240v and 500v motors

    any thing less than say 10mohm may need further checking or anylisis with below 1 not acceptable...above 10 everyhting should be ok
    ( i think I have that right)...I use an analogue meggar and have become accustomed to just reading the location of the needle on the scale and dont actually notice the reading)
    Thanks Eskimo. I will have a play. Re the second scale, I wondered whether the ability to read Chinese would be of assistance here (Joe, another trip to the uni.) or if it is just for people who are dyslexic. Can Google translate Chinese characters from a picture? I guess you would have to provide the actual symbols. Gotta go. Got the shaper outside the shed hanging in the breeze and it could rain.

    Dean

  15. #59
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    Strange looking dial setup... I did a quick search and found an chinglish manual

    ftp://[email protected]:Uzu%40!nwtu...09%20D6310.doc

    No idea why they would put two identical ranges on the same switch.... maybe for left and right handed operators?

    Ray

    PS... As eskimo says they don't hurt ....much...

  16. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayG View Post
    Strange looking dial setup... I did a quick search and found an chinglish manual

    ftp://[email protected]:Uzu%40!nwtu...09%20D6310.doc

    No idea why they would put two identical ranges on the same switch.... maybe for left and right handed operators?

    Ray

    PS... As eskimo says they don't hurt ....much...
    Any worse than stepping over an electric fence?

    Thanks for the link Ray.

    Hmm. Clear as mud. Maybe its me. First time remember. I'm a Megger Virgin

    4.L (LINE) input terminal (connected to line terminal of the to-be-tested object).
    5.G input terminal: shielded terminal of the insulating resistance.
    6.E (EARTH) input terminal (connected to EARTH terminal of the o-be-tested object)
    Earth I can cope with.

    The other 2 are connected to each end of the windings, so "G input terminal: shielded terminal of the insulating resistance." is the star point yes/no? And in order that each winding is checked seperately, the star point should be seperated first?

    I could have researched this myself.

    It was starting to rain when I went back out with my coffee which was the main reason I came inside. Shaper is safe and the skates got another workout. I have thought of an idea for using skates. Thick neoprene on top so all the skates follow the machine.

    I am cleaning off the top of one of my benches so I will have a decent place to work on this motor instead of a little card table with a missing leg locking strap. Too many jobs and too little time.

    Dean

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