Thread: Who really wins Ebay auctions

Originally Posted by Ch4iS

I counted $4700 worth of machinery for June, as mentioned there are also 3 mills.
I'll stop posting now

Imagen the fees on that amount.

I have bought a fair bit off him and while postage is high some times he has always combined when asked and when some thing was missing he replaced it.
I see the parallels that I bought for $50 are now selling for $100 under bidding. I wonder if he is bidding them up as well, he used to have a buy it now for them of $59.
Dave

What has the human race descended too - it is time we stood up and said enough is enough.

Now you are telling me that it is ok for a business to place bids to artificially push me up - even if it's against the rules.

Following on from this then it is ok for the Real estate agent to bid against you on your dream house because you haven't reached the reserve - even though you are the only one bidding

IT IS AN AUCTION

If you chose to sell via this means then you follow the rules - that means the price only goes up when a genuine buyer bids - that is why its an auction. If you want to control the sale then dont use auction to sell.



You probably think that if someone breaks into my house or car and takes something that belongs to me that it is my fault because i should have hidden it out of sight.

I suppose you support the treatment handed to K RUDD last week - the lying cheating scheming.

Or the fact that the Melb Storm just went over the salary cap to keep all its good players together.

Also that it is ok for a TV channel to name a case (instead of using "high profile case") when reporting a possible police corruption a couple of years ago.

You probably think the media are the right ones to change football coaches, sack leaders, influence inquiries, change political parties that are supposed to represent us.

Get real some of you people - we are humans, we used to live by rules like - do unto others as you would have them do to you - or treat someone as you would want to be treated -

GET REAL the animals behave better than humans.

Time for the HUMANS to stand up and say that is enough - for the vigilantes to take back our streets make them safe for "normal" people.

I'll tell you why we have stooped to this level because most of you are too scared or gutless to upset someone and actually tell them it is not right.

rant off

david

Originally Posted by Dave J

Imagen the fees on that amount.

I have bought a fair bit off him and while postage is high some times he has always combined when asked and when some thing was missing he replaced it.
I see the parallels that I bought for $50 are now selling for $100 under bidding. I wonder if he is bidding them up as well, he used to have a buy it now for them of $59.
Dave

I would think the volume he sells and the amount he makes from bidding on his own items would make the fees negligible, there is normally someone watching that will bid at the last second. I'd say $150-$250 in fees for that lot over a month period, since hes a big seller he'd be clearing five figures a month easy in sales IMO.

Originally Posted by Edster

It's not the same as a reserve price though.

The harm is to other sellers. Those who put their legit starting price on ebay don't get bids when they could actually be the better deal.

It also harms the second hand market. The poor guy selling their nice mill second-hand on ebay won't be able to set a decent reserve price to compete with the dishonest shill bidding merchant who's selling new.

Buyers are also hurt because they are not going to bid on the honestly priced items because they think they are going to get it cheaper.

I'm mystified by this because, unless I am missing something, it looks like a very good reason not to trust the seller. He is trying to maximise his profit by tricking the buyer. Anyone up to those games is not trustworthy and I won't do business with them. I will also go out of my way to highlight these practices to others. Good post Edster.

Originally Posted by rodm

Ozmestore has been around for a long time and I have got a heap of gear from him over the years. He doesn't rip you off on transport and is quick on delivery. He carrys a lot of gear and his inventory must be worth a lot of money. I want him to keep going as a seller as the alternatives are a lot more expensive. He isn't going to last long if his sell price is less than his buy price so given ebay changed the rules to force every listing that is bid on to be a sale I can understand why he is doing it.

I agree with you RodM. I use him a lot, he always combines postage and ive never had a prob.

I also however became convinced he was participating in his own auctions a while ago. I have been watching his square column mill for ages now, he sold 8 in a row between 1300 and 1500 bucks, and I assume he participated in all of those auctions. I do however know that he was actually selling them to people (as opposed to winning them himself), as there are two blokes in this forum with the same mill that I know of who got them in the cheaper part of that price range.

Now I see that he has changed that listing to buy it now price of $1800. So he obviously has had a gutful of letting them go too cheaply. I can either buy the mill through a "fair" sale for $1800, or I could have got it through one of his dodgy auctions for a hell of a lot cheaper. I know which id prefer.

Originally Posted by rodm

Ozmestore has been around for a long time and I have got a heap of gear from him over the years. He doesn't rip you off on transport and is quick on delivery. He carrys a lot of gear and his inventory must be worth a lot of money. I want him to keep going as a seller as the alternatives are a lot more expensive. He isn't going to last long if his sell price is less than his buy price so given ebay changed the rules to force every listing that is bid on to be a sale I can understand why he is doing it.

Originally Posted by 19brendan81

I agree with you RodM. I use him a lot, he always combines postage and ive never had a prob.

I also however became convinced he was participating in his own auctions a while ago. I have been watching his square column mill for ages now, he sold 8 in a row between 1300 and 1500 bucks, and I assume he participated in all of those auctions. I do however know that he was actually selling them to people (as opposed to winning them himself), as there are two blokes in this forum with the same mill that I know of who got them in the cheaper part of that price range.

Now I see that he has changed that listing to buy it now price of $1800. So he obviously has had a gutful of letting them go too cheaply. I can either buy the mill through a "fair" sale for $1800, or I could have got it through one of his dodgy auctions for a hell of a lot cheaper. I know which id prefer.

Human nature sad isn't it

I've had a look at this and note a few things:

Shill bidding is very clearly against eBays rules.

The insertion fee is based on the starting or reserve price (which has not been removed). By dropping the start price and shill bidding a seller is ripping off eBay. Saying the rules are bad or eBay can afford it is no excuse here, the agreement is made when they join up, if they don't like it they should go elsewhere. You can't trust a seller who avoids the rules to their advantage. What other 'rules' might they avoid if they are inconvenient?

What harm is it doing? The buyer is looking to compare and buy, the seller is looking to advertise and sell. Both side want some sort of fairness in the transaction. Shill bidders are removing the fairness and stealing the attention of customers away from where the buyer may have well got a better deal. Some good reasons were put earlier by Edster.

Put simply, the practice is DISHONEST. Blaming eBay rules or anyone else is a deflection from the fact the practice is dishonest. They are misleading buyers, cheating eBay and trading unfairly against other traders who operate within the rules. I still cannot see any reasonable argument to support these practices, shill bidding is fraud, plain and simple.

Just out of interest, if you look at who buys, and who they buy from, you will find at least one other buyer to the one already listed who seems to frequent just that one seller and who never buy from anyone else.

I think this is getting beyond where it should be.

I just had a look at the listings and I think what is happening is that people are assuming that because a buyer has the same abbreviation (alias) for one listing then it follows that it is the same buyer on another listing - if it has the same alias.
I don't think this is true as the aliases are only two characters and it would be impossible to have one two character alias for every ebayer. I would think it is structured as a listing number and then alias to link to the buyer.

Correct me if I am wrong on this but it looks like some have jumped the gun on the guilty verdict.

CALM,
I haven't read you posts before so I am not sure if you are sitting there with a big paddle or serious. If you are serious then don't worry about the intestinal fortitude of those on this forum and change what you can change rather than attack fellow forumites with your frustrations. If you are paddling a large stick then there is no need for me to apologize for my last statement. Respond if you feel you need to but don't expect me to beyond this.

Rod, I'll PM you two links then you can post whether I have the wrong end of the stick.

Originally Posted by rodm

I think this is getting beyond where it should be.

I just had a look at the listings and I think what is happening is that people are assuming that because a buyer has the same abbreviation (alias) for one listing then it follows that it is the same buyer on another listing - if it has the same alias.
I don't think this is true as the aliases are only two characters and it would be impossible to have one two character alias for every ebayer. I would think it is structured as a listing number and then alias to link to the buyer.

Correct me if I am wrong on this but it looks like some have jumped the gun on the guilty verdict.

Hi rod, you can click the username and see it has the same bidding profile, + the feedback is the same (it even changed to 7 when he left himself feedback), there is no doubt it is the same user, unless there is some strange reason it8 needs 3 mills and continues to bid on more mills "especially the super fast feedback", I would say it is ozmestore1 who is bidding on his own items.

Here is a second account, I do not know the full username but it has the same activity as it8

Bidding Details

Would be good to hear something from ebay, if you get a reply redshirt.

Thanks Groggy and Ch4is

It does look suspect from those listings.

You guys know your way around ebay much better than I do. As it is an alias I didn't know you could look into their feedback.

I wanted those castors too.

I buy a lot from Ozmestore but I don't bid on machinery items (new) I always use the buy it now items as I need it not want it. I don't notice the bidding for that reason I guess and while I think its dodgy I can live with it as I don't bid on items from people that are big sellers as they have similar items on the buy it now whish ends up around the same price. It may sound mercenary but in the end I get the tools I need and where I live the nearest city is 3ookms away and no store here that sells them for a fair price (Same quality but 3 times the price) and usually couple weeks to order it in.
Take it as you like but ebay stores are a boon to those of us in the country areas.
Pete

Guess who is the highest bidder on the mini mill that finishes soon?
X2 DOVETAIL MINI MILL / DRILL MACHINE (GENUINE) - eBay, Equipment, Machinery, Metalworking, Industrial. (end time 29-Jun-10 20:08:06 AEST)