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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
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    Brisbane, Qld
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    927

    Default Dust port on Wonderfence

    Hi folks,

    Just wondering if anyone has an opinion... Does the dust extraction port on the wonderfence actually benefit from the right angle they include, or do they just throw it in to help route the hose away from the outfeed?

    Cheers,

    Danny

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Albury
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    I don't have a Wonderfence. But, gee I wish I did! Was doing some jointing on the router table on the weekend and, while the result is fabulous, the setup time is a real PITA.

    woodPixel is one member who might have an opinion on your question.
    Forum members PM me for a discount on all my products - https://www.ebay.com.au/str/aldavsstore

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Caboolture QLD AU
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    761

    Default

    Any fitting that changes the direction of flow creates a resistance and therefore a loss in flow, however IMHO because of the diameter of the air channel through the fence and the intake sizing, the available flow rate should hardly be affected at all by that adapter.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    23,295

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MandJ View Post
    Any fitting that changes the direction of flow creates a resistance and therefore a loss in flow, however IMHO because of the diameter of the air channel through the fence and the intake sizing, the available flow rate should hardly be affected at all by that adapter.
    Yep - I agree. The narrow width and sharp edged intake gap/channel is going to let very little air into the hose.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Perth WA Australia
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    511

    Default

    yep, it doesn't do very much, hardly any air flows through, the fence the port is just too small for good air flow. What I do find annoying about the wonderfence is that it likes to gather dust on the opposite end of the dust port. You could remove the black end cap but i suspect that would do very little.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
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    Brisbane, Qld
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    Default

    Yeah, I'm not expecting anything great, only trying to clear chips until I get actual dust extraction happening under the table as best I can... In the long term I am tempted to try adding positive pressure to the wonderfence to try to push air and dust down under the table!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Perth WA Australia
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    511

    Default

    I feel like that might not do much and you might end up blowing dust into the motor. Plus the airflow bottle neck will either be the throat plate or the space around the router and its mount to the table top. So even if you have a 6" under table port it'll be restricted by the bottle neck. If you really wanted to increase efficiency your best bet will be to add an additional overhead port.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Caboolture QLD AU
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    761

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tonzeyd View Post
    I feel like that might not do much and you might end up blowing dust into the motor. Plus the airflow bottle neck will either be the throat plate or the space around the router and its mount to the table top. So even if you have a 6" under table port it'll be restricted by the bottle neck. If you really wanted to increase efficiency your best bet will be to add an additional overhead port.
    Yes, that's the best way to get the bad stuff with current router bases and insert plate design, although depending on the work it can still leave a mess over the table. The only way to get full chip and fine dust extraction is to redesign the router base, mounting plate / insert plate and throat plate, do that and you don't need overhead pickup or fence hose connection, and only a single 6" port below the table with the correct port position and intake openings. Could still work with your current fence if it allowed for a slight modification, but likely not feasible for most RT owners unless the dust causes you a health or workshop problem.

    BTW They're a nice fence and I love the available fixtures and precision.

    Mike.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonzeyd View Post
    yep, it doesn't do very much, hardly any air flows through, the fence the port is just too small for good air flow. What I do find annoying about the wonderfence is that it likes to gather dust on the opposite end of the dust port. You could remove the black end cap but i suspect that would do very little.
    That's not as silly as it sounds - any dust collected is good.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Perth WA Australia
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    Default

    Agreed, since its there you may as well use it. I've got the fency port piggy backing off a 6" port under the table and removing the end cap you can barely feel any air flow. But as Bob says something is better than nothing.

  11. #11
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    Feb 2006
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    Perth
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonzeyd View Post
    Agreed, since its there you may as well use it. I've got the fency port piggy backing off a 6" port under the table and removing the end cap you can barely feel any air flow. But as Bob says something is better than nothing.
    Better still would be a MMH on that end but it would get in the way on the indeed - could still probably fit 2/3 of a BMH.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
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    Caboolture QLD AU
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    Default

    Random thoughts on the RT fence extraction V below table extraction.



    With below table dust extraction and sufficient real flow rate to extract dust, even a very small insert ring clearance around the bit is still going to pull some fast (as opposed to volume) air flow down over the bit and through the table (amount depends on a number of factors) - thus fighting the fence intake and the fence intake fighting below table extraction - Right at the bit .

    When working against the fence with the timber covering the insert ring, then only the exposed part of the ring in front of the fence is covered, the insert ring below the fence opening and behind the bit is still pulling air and again both fighting each other. Using a zero clearance FENCE insert will reduce fence dust pickup substantially depending on the fence design, position of work, airflow through the fence (most use a small hose connection) and the size of the timber being worked.

    Perhaps designers think that opposing airflow paths around the bit makes no real difference to dust extraction because router tables are a special exception to normal air flow?

    Thoughts?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Perth WA Australia
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    Default

    I think dust extraction on a router table is more about containment. Obviously effectiveness of dust extraction depends on a number of factors as you've outlined. As unlike a table saw an all in one solution isn't feasible/practicle given the number of variables at play.

    I suspect given that the number of bottle necks that can occur combined with the flow/disturbance the router bit generates itself the design isn't as important.

    Also given that most things seem to be made to tick a box it wouldn't be entirely be surprising if no real thought was placed into the design.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
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    Caboolture QLD AU
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    Default

    I agree with your thoughts for the current way almost every RT is constructed, however the router bit is not the real problem, if anything it helps and bottle necks are easy to overcome with a bit of a redesign.

    I have virtually 100% containment under all conditions in my table, both invisibles and chips, with or without a fence and including through dados which normally spew dust and chips at the start and end of the work.

    Using a CNC makes it even simpler, however, providing you are willing to modify a standard router base plate then it's rather simple. But again I think most people are happy to just clean up each time and go with the quick over the counter solutions. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that decision, but I had to find a way to be able to use the RT without wearing a mask if I can help it, not having to clean up is a bonus. I now try to find a reasons to use the RT every chance I get, the complete opposite to the way it was before I came up with a way to do DE correctly and with minimal cost, in my case around $60, but I guess I'm getting the thread off track so I'll leave it at that.

    Cheers.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
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    Default

    Yeah, time is my constraint on fixing up dust extraction. I know I really should get to it (need to make a couple of BMHs for my lather and edge sander, as well as doing something about the router table), it's just so much more fun making things for outside the workshop!).

    BTW MandJ - I keep meaning to post on the thread about your table, it's a work of art!

    Cheers,

    Danny

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