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  1. #16
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    Thanks for the advice all - Mobyturns in particular for the comprehensive analysis. I think in my case the big question is "What can I do to avoid this?". Answer: Go back to what has always worked for me - recess and expansion mode.

    I mount the blank on a faceplate, finish the back (including sanding), turn around and mount in expansion mode, finish the inside, polish on the lathe and then re-mount on the Coleman chuck to tidy the recess. I rarely have any problems using this method and I commonly turn platters & bowls up to 40cm diameter.

    I am sure with all your good advice I could master spigots and contraction mode, but I still struggle to see any advantage. Either way the base needs to be tidied up and from a safety point of view, expansion mode seems to be lower risk. I rarely cut a recess larger than 50 - 60mm (with a good bit of surrounding timber), even on the larger items. I started out this way as I was given to understand that the chucks work best with minimum expansion in that mode. Very, very rarely need to tighten the chuck (even though I check regularly).

    As to being lucky I was not injured, yes, although in this instance and in almost all of my turning time, I try to work from a position whereby any flying objects bypass me. Using the swivel head on the lathe and being naturally ambidextrous help here. I made this a habit after having a couple of close calls when I first started turning - using spigots now that I think about it! Did a bit of spindle turning yesterday and had a piece fly off. Lucky I wear my Triton full face respirator as it hit right in front of my eyes.

    Anyway, unless someone can provide a compelling reason why spigots are an advantage, I guess I am a recess man! (My Son would say Caveman)

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce White View Post
    I try to work from a position whereby any flying objects bypass me.
    +1
    Stay sharp and stay safe!

    Neil



  4. #18
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    Jan 2015
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    Anna Bay, NSW, Australia
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    Default Which chuck

    Sorry this is so long ago but just got back after long time away. The chuck on the left - is that a Leadbeatter chuck and if so is it as simple as drilling a forstner 60mm "dimple" , inserting chuck and turning to engage or is this totally wrong - I have no instructions with the chuck. TIA
    Steve
    Quote Originally Posted by orraloon View Post
    I mostly go expansion mode where I can. If there is enough wood and the grain looks like it can take it. I only have the 50mm jaws for my Nova and may feel different if I had something else for larger work. The other chuck I use(more than the nova) only works on expansion anyhow.
    Regards
    John

  5. #19
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    Big A, they used to call that (Nos 1,2&3) "Risk Assessment and Hazard Management" and have all these little Tables where you had to enter the degree of risk. I spent more of my time at courses that were preaching this than I spent running my work-sites. Glad I'm out of it!!
    Cheers
    Mick C

    Quote Originally Posted by Big A View Post
    In my job, I have to go onto a mining site, therefore I have had to do inductions in a whole range of of things. The generic mine induction (now called something else) is one of these. There is a lot of information given out and not a lot of time to actually learn anything. But one piece of wisdom I have absorbed, because the instructor emphasised it:

    1. What am I about to do?
    2. What can go wrong?
    3. What can I do to avoid this?

    Which sums up what Mobyturns said and what does.

    You all know about the "Hierarchy of Controls" don't you?

    "A".
    mañana

  6. #20
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    Mick Check the dates. This is nearly 2 years old. Phil

  7. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeilS View Post
    John, that one's a blast from the past. Surprised to see it still in use, but then it did a great job before other options became available. Only pensioned mine off after I got a few Novas.

    It is probably the reason why I developed my techniques around expansion mode and rarely resort to spigots and contraction mode.
    I still use mine, a great little chuck wouldnt be with out it. Still use my SN2's for a lot of turning.

    For me it has to do with what I'm turning and the species being used. I routinely use my Leady chuck in expansion and all my SN2 chucks in contraction and rarely have a problem. Usually its when I push my luck and give my reflexes a work out
    Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working. — Pablo Picasso


  8. #22
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    me 2


    Quote Originally Posted by NeilS View Post
    +1
    Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working. — Pablo Picasso


  9. #23
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    Default

    I use a wide variety of chucks, each one has a "best suited" application, and have done so for a long time. The first thing I do before staring a bowl is to sharpen all the tools. My biggest problem with chucks is that they dictate the size of the base, I don't like that.

    If I am making a bowl I may fix it to a face plate with screws from the top and turn the back and foot. I will screw a waste or sacrificial block to the face plate, turn it to match the bowl foot and glue the two together. Face plates are a hell of a lot cheaper and more reliable than a chuck. Granted, not as fast as using a chuck, you will have to wait for glue to dry. That is called job planning.

    I use a hand saw to remove the bowl from the waste block and clean up the foot. This method eliminates breaking tenons and splitting of wood. Don't get me wrong, I still and will use a chuck where appropriate.

    Jim
    Sometimes in the daily challenges that life gives us, we miss what is really important...

  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce White View Post
    ....

    I think in my case the big question is "What can I do to avoid this?". Answer: Go back to what has always worked for me - recess and expansion mode.

    I try to work from a position whereby any flying objects bypass me.

    I guess I am a recess man! (My Son would say Caveman)
    Wow this one is like Lazarus - back from the dead.

    Bruce raises some good points - use what you feel comfortable with - its not a matter of being a caveman, it simply works for you & your style of turning.

    Work stance at the lathe is a significant part of staying safe however it is risky to heavily rely upon where you position your body if you still use risky work holding methods or blanks that have voids & cracks etc & pose a higher level of risk than sound blanks. Bowls and parts of them can easily ricochet in small workshops. "Safe" turning is simply employing all the tricks & techniques you have available to you to minimize risk.

    Waggasteve,

    Powderpost points out tried & proven techniques that worked for all turners before four jaw scroll chucks became commonplace. They are still very good techniques, very safe & low risk techniques. It pays to learn a range of work holding methods as each has particular advantages for certain turning applications.

    Be careful simply boring a recess with a forstner bit to create a recess for chuck jaws. Forstner bits drill nice holes with parallel sides. Most jaw sets rely upon some form of jaw lip or more commonly a taper to securely grip the blank. Straight sided recesses can cause wobble.
    Mobyturns

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  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mobyturns View Post

    Be careful simply boring a recess with a forstner bit to create a recess for chuck jaws. Forstner bits drill nice holes with parallel sides. Most jaw sets rely upon some form of jaw lip or more commonly a taper to securely grip the blank. Straight sided recesses can cause wobble.
    I used the forstner bit method for awhile, then went back to faceplates and/or screw, which was a quicker method for me. When using the forstner method I found it was worth quickly forming a foot (recess or spigot) re-gripping the blank with that to reform a dovetail inside the forstner recess and re-gripping the blank again on that end and proceeding from there. Not necessary on small bowls, but worth it on larger and irregular shaped blanks.

    Don't be tempted to make the forstner recess too deep and certainly no deeper than the depth of the dovetail section of the jaw. The jaws grip better when they bottom out in the recess.
    Stay sharp and stay safe!

    Neil



  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by WaggaSteve View Post
    Sorry this is so long ago but just got back after long time away. The chuck on the left - is that a Leadbeatter chuck and if so is it as simple as drilling a forstner 60mm "dimple" , inserting chuck and turning to engage or is this totally wrong - I have no instructions with the chuck. TIA
    Steve
    It is a Leadbetter chuck and I have a Leadbetter cutter to cut the recess. I guess a forstener bit would do the same job. I make the recess deep enough for the shoulder to sit nice and flat then turn the work clockwise to tighten.


    As to concerns about no dovetail side to the recess it is not required for this sort of chuck that keeps tightening with the cutting action on the lathe. The jaw edges also bite into the recess wall. I use this chuck a lot due to ease of use and for some tasks prefer it to my nova.

    Regards
    John
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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by orraloon View Post
    It is a Leadbetter chuck and I have a Leadbetter cutter to cut the recess. I guess a forstener bit would do the same job. I make the recess deep enough for the shoulder to sit nice and flat then turn the work clockwise to tighten.


    As to concerns about no dovetail side to the recess it is not required for this sort of chuck that keeps tightening with the cutting action on the lathe. The jaw edges also bite into the recess wall. I use this chuck a lot due to ease of use and for some tasks prefer it to my nova.

    Regards
    John
    I haven't used the Leadbetter chuck. As you say it is important to follow the designers recommendations. My comments were about the now more common jaw sets using dovetail jaw design.
    Mobyturns

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  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mobyturns View Post
    My comments were about the now more common jaw sets using dovetail jaw design.
    Me too.
    Stay sharp and stay safe!

    Neil



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