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4th August 2021, 09:17 PM #1
H&F Mini wood Lathe . Use for grinding tools?
I have mentioned this somewhere once . I don't remember where or what was said.
These H&F lathes.
W385 - WL-14V Mini Wood Lathe | Hare & Forbes Machineryhouse
356mm swing over the bed and .75HP variable speed. Ive been wondering "again" if I mounted a 200mm CBN wheel to a MT2 shaft and fitted that to this lathe , backed up by the tail stock pressure, would the motor size run the wheel OK for tool sharpening?
I don't have CBN yet and wonder if they run and work with a light touch or do you find you have to lean on them a little?
This sort of CBN wheel.https://www.timbecon.com.au/sherwood...BoCN-4QAvD_BwE
The advantage may be I could have a number of wheels mounted on MT2 stubs and swap them over when needed and the variable speed is good to . Not just CBN but other narrower options for other uses . If it was powerful enough maybe a couple of grades of wheels could be mounted on one to run on the one MT2 shaft at same time .
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4th August 2021, 09:48 PM #2SENIOR MEMBER
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Definitely no need to lean on them, I'm sure it would be fine if you can get it to run true and as you say, use the tailstock to prevent it from backing out.
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4th August 2021, 10:04 PM #3Senior Member
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I have a WL-14v and have jury-rigged a number of grinding, sanding and polishing attachments (but not CBN wheels). All work fine and the lathe seeems to handle them with ease at varying speeds so I'd guess that CBN wouldn't be a problem. My only concern with your proposal might be if you rig them on an MT2 shaft. That would probably be OK with tail stock support but even then I'm not sure you wouldn't get some shaft slippage. I had that problem with a head stock mounted MT2 Jacobs chuck I have. My solution has been to rig the attachments to fit one of my scroll chucks rather than mounting them in the head stock taper. I have just used turned hard wooden mounts with approprite steel shafts bolted through (you could of course turn steel chuck mounts if you have a metal lathe). Cheap and effective...and not overly difficult to rig so no need tp mount multiple wheels on a single shaft. I'm assuming you will use the CBN wheel for tool sharpening, not heavy duty grinding and, if so, I belive you could use this system with a CBN wheel at slower sharpening speeds and not even need tail stock support.
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4th August 2021, 10:59 PM #4
That sounds good then thanks Picko and doragus.
I have a metal lathe and could get something like this
MORSE TAPER MT2 SOFT STUB BLANK ARBOR M10 X 1.5 DRAWBAR -MILLING, LATHE TOOLS | eBay
Maybe turn its end to fit the grinding wheel, then drill and tap the end to take a bolt to hold wheel on . After that Drill a center in the bolt head for the tail stock live center.
Good to hear you have used the WL-14V for grinding too doragus. Do You fund the speed control handy for grinding?
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5th August 2021, 11:53 AM #5Senior Member
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I'd be happier using the head stock MT if everything was secured with a drawbar but it seems a bit complicated to me. Give some thought to scroll chuck mounting.
Speed control is exactly the reason I have gone to the trouble of setting up to use the lathe for sharpening. I don't have a slow-speed grinder or wet sharpener and I find the speed of my normal bench grinders are just too aggressive for a lot of the lathe tool sharpening I need.
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5th August 2021, 02:35 PM #6
I cant see why it cant be done but that said do you want to have to remove your bowl or whatever every time the gouge needs a touch up. It would drive me nuts.
Regards
John
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5th August 2021, 05:14 PM #7
That's a good idea too ! That may be easy. Some of the MT2 blanks Ive seen come with the tapered end tapped already.
RDGTOOLS 2MT SOFT STUB ARBOUR BLANK END 28 X 30MM WITH DRAWBAR LATHES MILLING | eBay
Yes I will consider that.
Same boat as I'm is with my grinders . And this seemed a better solution to getting a grinder that is slow . That's the problem though , their fixed at sort of slow, 1480 I think ? I don't think Ive seen any with speed control . Ive always really liked slow grinding as its very accurate when needed . Ive been using a bench fitted hand cranked one for all turning tools for years . sometimes I use the sandpaper on my linisher too . As well as fast normal Al Oxide.
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5th August 2021, 05:25 PM #8
That would drive me nuts too John .
I'm getting this set up next to my two other lathes just for quick more accurate sharpening than I get with my hand cranked jigger . Hand cranked using one hand is ok on gouges but not as good on skew or parting tools. I do use Al oxide and linisher for sharpening as well . Their up the other end of an 18 Meter walk though .
Other lathes are a Wadkin RS 8 and a typical older Woodfast . I don't know if there will ever be a need to turn on a third lathe for really small stuff which is what I do on the Woodfast already. It'll be another option I have though.
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5th August 2021, 06:04 PM #9Senior Member
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I should have said earlier that I have two lathes and two scroll chucks so no need to remove work when I want to sharpen.
Another tip before you shell out $200+ on a CBN wheel. Have a look at 8" Grit 180/320/600 Diamond Grinding Wheel Discs For Sharpener Chain ChainSaw | eBay
Mount these on a flat wooden disk with a fitting for your scroll chuck and you might find they do the job you want.
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5th August 2021, 11:05 PM #10
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6th August 2021, 08:16 AM #11Senior Member
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6th August 2021, 08:17 AM #12GOLD MEMBER
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6th August 2021, 09:06 AM #13.
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Those discs are available from THK on ebay for about half the price of that link above.
https://www.ebay.com.au/str/thkdiamo...p2047675.l2563
Based in HK, THK is a reputable company that we (SWMBO and I) have been buying from for about a decade.
Back in 2012 the 6" discs were between us $8 and $12 I bought SWMBO a grit set (80 - 1200) for her lapping machine that she uses for her glass jewellery mess making activities. She's only ever used 2 of them so I purloined one for the side of one of my CBN wheels (see E on pic below).
6" is a good size for the side of an 8" grinding as it does not interfere with the sides
The diamond wheel is backed with a 5" diameter 12mm steel disc as I do use the edge to sharpen things and need to be able to get right around the back edge.
Combo1.jpg
I mainly use the diamond wheel for sharpening Tungsten Carbide tips (TIG, MW lathe and masonry bits)
In a pro situation diamond is not supposed to be suitable for grinding ferrous material but probably not an issue in DIY space.
Since that pic was taken have replaced D with F and put a second CBN wheel on F and put a 100 mm diamond cup wheel on the side of that wheel.
Screen Shot 2021-08-06 at 6.03.53 am.jpg
To be effective small wheels and discs have to be spun faster which is why those grinders above are on a VFD.
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6th August 2021, 11:35 AM #14
I could do that . Or I could put the CBN wheels on one of my standard 2850 speed grinders . Or I could continue the resto job that stalled on a 3 phase 2850 grinder and set it up with VFD for speed control .
Looking at the lathe idea though , as long as its powerful enough , it solves one issue I have with grinders .
I tend to set up a grinder and it stays that way . All the playing around with bushes and fitting the wheels of what ever type . I don't like changing them around unless I really have to after that. So Ive got about 5 twin wheel grinders set up already . And I need more . I want a grinding station for the metal lathe.
I want a grinding station for the wood turning lathes . And its about time I tried the CBN everyone is talking about which is better used with speed control . The CBN has got to be good for HSS Metal lathe shaping too yeah !
A set up with speed control and easy interchangeable wheels could be the way and put an end to adding to many more grinders . And it offers some interesting things Id like to try out .
CBN wheels on the wall ready to use .
I use thin wheels for sharpening spindle moulder knives but don't have speed control and that would be a good thing .
One thing Ive always thought would be great is sharpening chisels , specially carving chisels on a leather wheel which has to run backwards . The vfd on this lathe has reverse.
Another good thing is the way a tool rest clamps to the bed of a lathe means making a grinding rest that's easily adjustable for any wheel size is easy .
The worst part about it is having to spend $600 on another toy in one hit .
That bridge has been crossed though and the lathe is on the way by courier .
Sometimes I feel though, you just have to do it and see, to have the understanding that comes from doing it, rather than to much thinking about it until your going around in the same circles. Ive been thinking about this for too long .
H&F had a sale which helped things along with this as well .
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6th August 2021, 12:42 PM #15
The CBN wheels are quite heavy so would definitely be getting an M2 with threaded end to take a drawbar. Using a live centre in the tailstock may be OK to hold it in place, but a drawbar would be extra insurance.
Also be aware that CBN wheels cannot be 'dressed' so any eccentricity or over tolerance in your machining of the M2 shaft will result in the wheel running out of true and bumping your tools. It's the same issue with bench grinders with out of true shafts (and shoulders) that can be tamed if using aggregate wheels by dressing them, but become a real problem with CBN or diamond wheels.
On diamond for sharpening HSS, I've been regularly using an 8" diamond wheel for at least ten years now (bought that before CBN came available at a reasonable price) and there is no way I will be wearing that one out in my life time. It's a resin matrix wheel, so has a quite deep diamond layer. I'm using CBN wheels as well now, so in another ten years I will be able to report on which type has lasted/performed the best...Stay sharp and stay safe!
Neil
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