Thread: Aussie wood for electric guitars

Originally Posted by kiwigeo

Interesting...where the pickups on the front of the guitar? I have to ask...why did you do this?

Pickups were in the front, but the sound was very muffled, but it was distinctly there but very soft. It was some years ago and the only reason for doing it was to see if there was going to a reaction. I didnt think there was going to be but only to a certain extent.

Jim, maybe not from inside the rout but somehow makes its way back to the top. I just cant see the sound bouncing around doing nothing and fading dead. The pickup has to be taking some of it in surely.

Unfortunately i dont really now know enough to put up a decent debate it wold take far too long to gain those skills, and i have far too little time to delve into a subject that at the end of the day will mean very little, other than "told you so". Like i said, im only talking of my experiences and my own theory (which i can not back up) So it can be given some thought or it can be taken in a grain of salt

Ive seen heaps of threads on the said subject matter but ive always chose to stay out, this is the only time that i have voiced my views and it only opens up a can of really ugly worms.

I have only made a couple of guitars and repaired a few so my luthier experience as far as im concerned is basically nil. But what i will be sticking with when i build my guitars in the future. If i want a loud crisp snapping guitar it will be hardwood and if i want mellow sweet tones ill be using a softer wood.

Argument on both sides of the fence i guess, its all good, its entertaining reading.

Greg

Originally Posted by Groundhangers

Jim, maybe not from inside the rout but somehow makes its way back to the top. I just cant see the sound bouncing around doing nothing and fading dead. The pickup has to be taking some of it in surely.

A magnetic pickup can only pickup the vibration of the guitars strings. If vibrations are bouncing around inside your pickup cavity as you say then the only way they can generate a signal in the pickup is by direct physical coupling with the string......ie via the saddle, fret or nut.

I've already stated that I believe that choice of body wood constitutes a minor influence on the sound of a solid body electric guitar. After doing a bit more research I would go as far as to say the choice of neck wood and neck design (particularly stiffness) has more influence than the choice of body wood. An obvious example is the affect neck wood density has on sustain on both acoustic and electric instruments.

I would not go so far as to say as some have that wood choice has has no effect on the sound of an electric. I see it acting as a tone filter in a similar way that a tone pot bleeds away certain frequencies to ground, so an electric guitar body removes energy from the strings (and puts it back when stage volumes are sufficient to produce feedback)
I don't think that desirable characteristics for a body wood can be simplified to dense is good.
Look at the commercially succesful models for Fender, the telecaster and stratocaster, The most sought after variations of these used lightweight alder and swamp ash.
With Gibson, lightweight mahogany was the timber of choice in the early years,and many consider the current models with denser Mahogany and relief holes to be inferior

Originally Posted by jeffhigh

I would not go so far as to say as some have that wood choice has has no effect on the sound of an electric. I see it acting as a tone filter in a similar way that a tone pot bleeds away certain frequencies to ground, so an electric guitar body removes energy from the strings (and puts it back when stage volumes are sufficient to produce feedback)
I don't think that desirable characteristics for a body wood can be simplified to dense is good.

I agree with this. The neck in particular can be very good at removing energy from the strings.

I note even in there discussions Martin there was ones for and ones against.
So we are still no closer to reaching a decision.
So to the first forum member to prove once and for all between now and Christmas what sounds the best solid wood or plywood, I will donate a Tasmanian Tiger Myrtle drop top.
Cheers, Bob

Originally Posted by kiwigeo

Here's a good discussion with some interesting studies quoted:

Tonewood does not affect electric guitar tone? - The Gear Page

Originally Posted by woodturner777

I note even in there discussions Martin there was ones for and ones against.
So we are still no closer to reaching a decision.
So to the first forum member to prove once and for all between now and Christmas what sounds the best solid wood or plywood, I will donate a Tasmanian Tiger Myrtle drop top.
Cheers, Bob

For me it's not about making a decision....for me it's about disproving some of the myths associated with wood and electric guitars. It's also about motivating forum members to delve deeper into the topic and find out WHY they believe what they believe. I'm an acoustic builder so in a way I'm biased in my opinions. That said I have not yet seen convincing evidence that choice of wood is the most important factor controlling the sound of an electric guitar.


It's a bit like some of the myths surrounding Stradivarius violins. There weren't any secret varnish recipes.....the fact the violins are old doesnt have much to do with their great sound either. Stradivarius was a skilled luthier and and he had access to good tonewood. There are luthiers of equal skill around today and modern violins that equal Strads in terms of craftsmanship and sound

Totaly agree with your comments below Martin.
This is how I believe and how I learnt in life everything I do.
I like to learn all there is about the subject why does this work, why will this not work Etc.
So to me this thread is motivating forum members, so thanks Martin for you thoughts on the subject, and I hope your nuts are Ok.
Cheers, Bob

Originally Posted by kiwigeo

For me it's not about making a decision....for me it's about disproving some of the myths associated with wood and electric guitars. It's also about motivating forum members to delve deeper into the topic and find out WHY they believe what they believe. I'm an acoustic builder so in a way I'm biased in my opinions. That said I have not yet seen convincing evidence that choice of wood is the most important factor controlling the sound of an electric guitar.


It's a bit like some of the myths surrounding Stradivarius violins. There weren't any secret varnish recipes.....the fact the violins are old doesnt have much to do with their great sound either. Stradivarius was a skilled luthier and and he had access to good tonewood. There are luthiers of equal skill around today and modern violins that equal Strads in terms of craftsmanship and sound

Originally Posted by woodturner777

but to me dense wood with a good tap tone the sound waves would travel better through this than they would through heaps of layers of crap ply wood with glue in between each layer, as after all that is what plywood is just crap wood sliced into thin strips.
Cheers Bob.

If you believe that "sound waves would travel better through" solid wood Bob, why would you think a trait like that would make a better electric guitar?

Why is ply "crap wood" Bob? I have seen and played solid bodies made of Mahogany ply and mahogany is hardly "crap" in luthiers terms.

Jim

Originally Posted by kiwigeo

A magnetic pickup can only pickup the vibration of the guitars strings. If vibrations are bouncing around inside your pickup cavity as you say then the only way they can generate a signal in the pickup is by direct physical coupling with the string......ie via the saddle, fret or nut.

Fair enough ill go with that, so it does find it way back there somehow, via the wood via the ......

I cant remember where but there was a clip i seen where someone mounted a pickup on the opposite side of the strings and opposite the other pickup, it was mounted in a way that it had no influence from the body whatsoever. The two pickups were switched to be alternated. The tones were totally different. The body unifluened pickup was distinctly twangier. Ill try and find it.

Originally Posted by Groundhangers

Jim, maybe not from inside the rout but somehow makes its way back to the top. I just cant see the sound bouncing around doing nothing and fading dead. The pickup has to be taking some of it in surely.
Greg

Martin said it Greg but try thinking of it like this. A magnetic pickup can not hear sound. The sound the strings make are not picked up by the pickups. All the pickup can read is the movement of the magnetic field that is induced into the string via the pickup magnet.

Jim

Jim no need to explain again, im not that thick i totally understand how a pickup works.



What i do need to know how and why the pickup is influenced by what surrounds it! I dont know how but i know it does.

Greg,

Nobody saying or implying that youre thick. Even the way an electromagnetic pickup works is a subject of argument....check out an earlier thread on this topic.

Jim, Like groundhangers reply quote, I am not thick either I have been working with wood on and off now for over 50 years and salvaging wood here in Tasmania on and off between travel and working overseas Etc since 1968, I believe what I want to Jim and you believe what you want, Its like I know that if timber is sawn on the quarter it is far more stable and less likely to move and this is what I tried to tell you in the A.N.Z.L.F.

Regards, Bob

Originally Posted by toejam

If you believe that "sound waves would travel better through" solid wood Bob, why would you think a trait like that would make a better electric guitar?

Why is ply "crap wood" Bob? I have seen and played solid bodies made of Mahogany ply and mahogany is hardly "crap" in luthiers terms.

Jim

Originally Posted by woodturner777

Jim, Like groundhangers reply quote, I am not thick either I have been working with wood on and off now for over 50 years and salvaging wood here in Tasmania on and off between travel and working overseas Etc since 1968, I believe what I want to Jim and you believe what you want, Its like I know that if timber is sawn on the quarter it is far more stable and less likely to move and this is what I tried to tell you in the A.N.Z.L.F.
Till some narrow minded hypocrite cut me off and told me I did not know what I was talking about, so if you want to believe I dont know what I am talking about fair enough no worries I don't care.
Regards, Bob

Bob, what has a beef you have with a member of another forum got to do with this thread? I'm an administrator on same forum so if you have an issue with how you were treated on the ANZLF then you can take it up with me via email and I'll pursue the matter.

If both yourself and Greg would like to pull up the post where Jim or anybody else either said or implied that either of you is "thick" then appropriate apologies will be offered.