Sealing turning blanks

Hi guys, I recently acquired a heap of different timber, camphor, rosewood cedar and some pecan
after chainsawing and bandsawing into turning blanks , then sealing normally I just use pva glue watered down with water 1/2 and 1/2 , this time I bought some end grain sealer from carbatec, $40.00 delivered
I really couldn't see any difference between the two.....:o
My question is what do others use and is there a better way to seal your blanks ??????
Couple of photos to show the fruits of my labour !

Smiife, how long is a piece of string? You will get many, many ways of doing it, usually all valid. For me, I started by using MobilcerM, but got sick if it because the wax never dries up here and gets on my clothes, bandsaw tables etc. I just use any paint I can scrounge, 2 thick coats, but plastic paint is my preference as it washes off me. The only issue I have had is it will run into any cracks, sometimes can be a problem if wanting to glue up the cracks later on but most sealers will.
Rgds,
Crocy.

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Originally Posted by Old Croc

Smiife, how long is a piece of string? You will get many, many ways of doing it, usually all valid. For me, I started by using MobilcerM, but got sick if it because the wax never dries up here and gets on my clothes, bandsaw tables etc. I just use any paint I can scrounge, 2 thick coats, but plastic paint is my preference as it washes off me. The only issue I have had is it will run into any cracks, sometimes can be a problem if wanting to glue up the cracks later on but most sealers will.
Rgds,
Crocy.

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Hi Crocy, yeah , I know if you ask 10 woodies a question you get 12 different answers......that's ok , I was just trying to get an idea of what others use, thanks for your thoughts mate :2tsup::2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:

I have used cheap packaging tape about 50mm wide wrapped around the rim of a variety of blanks with very few failures and also any old paint liberally applied to the rim, again with only a few failures.

Another method is to melt wax in an old electric frypan etc. from cheap candles obtained at garage sales for next to nothing and roll the rim in the liquid wax. You only need a few millimeters of depth and it can smell quite nice as a bonus!

No method is 100% reliable, there will be the odd failure. Not all failures are catastrophic, you may only loose a few mm's of diameter removing the minor cracks.

Hope you have success, some nice looking blanks in that pile.

Alan...

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Originally Posted by Uncle Al

I have used cheap packaging tape about 50mm wide wrapped around the rim of a variety of blanks with very few failures and also any old paint liberally applied to the rim, again with only a few failures.

Another method is to melt wax in an old electric frypan etc. from cheap candles obtained at garage sales for next to nothing and roll the rim in the liquid wax. You only need a few millimeters of depth and it can smell quite nice as a bonus!

No method is 100% reliable, there will be the odd failure. Not all failures are catastrophic, you may only loose a few mm's of diameter removing the minor cracks.

Hope you have success, some nice looking blanks in that pile.

Alan...

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Hi Alan, yeah , good idea about the tape hadn't thought about that :2tsup:
I did wrap a couple of blanks with shrink wrap and put them in the freezer......will see how that goes :U

I used a log end sealer for a while (circa 2007) and treated a heap of Camphor logs with it - with very little success I might add. As it was only sold in 20 lt drums I was stuck with a lot of it. Most timbers seemed OK but the camphor didn't like it at all.

Crocy's timber has also fared very well with the paint treatment. John.G uses log end sealer in bulk and boards I have purchased from him have fared very well so it does work. Being an emulsion of waxes, I think it is important to keep within its shelf life, so fresh stock & high turnover. Trevor Atwood (Tolga Timbers / Gallery) used the clear packaging tape on already dried blanks - also seems to work in that application.

Now I use watered down PVA which doesn't have any of the hassles of the wax emulsion based log end sealers.

Given a choice I'd use Mobilcer-M, but given that where I live now I have problems sourcing it in the quantities I want at realistic prices, I've moved onto other alternatives.

In my experience, anything is better than leaving freshly felled green timber unsealed. That's a guaranteed near total loss rate for turning blank sizes. :rolleyes:

To my mind, dipping in wax is the second most effective method, followed by dipping in paint. I haven't tried dilute PVA on sufficient varieties, in enough batches or over sufficient time to work out how it rates, but I have used it when I've nothing else to hand and I'm confident it works. I think 'tis better than paint but, as I said, I don't have enough data to say one way or t'other.

I should point out that I seal freshly felled logs on site then, when back in the shed, I split the heart out and reseal. The effectiveness of each type of sealer may - and probably does - vary if one is sealing partially or fully cured timbers to protect them from humidity changes.

Still... anything is far superior to nothing. :)

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Originally Posted by Mobyturns

I used a log end sealer for a while (circa 2007) and treated a heap of Camphor logs with it - with very little success I might add. As it was only sold in 20 lt drums I was stuck with a lot of it. Most timbers seemed OK but the camphor didn't like it at all.

Crocy's timber has also fared very well with the paint treatment. John.G uses log end sealer in bulk and boards I have purchased from him have fared very well so it does work. Being an emulsion of waxes, I think it is important to keep within its shelf life, so fresh stock & high turnover. Trevor Atwood (Tolga Timbers / Gallery) used the clear packaging tape on already dried blanks - also seems to work in that application.

Now I use watered down PVA which doesn't have any of the hassles of the wax emulsion based log end sealers.

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Originally Posted by Skew ChiDAMN!!

Given a choice I'd use Mobilcer-M, but given that where I live now I have problems sourcing it in the quantities I want at realistic prices, I've moved onto other alternatives.

In my experience, anything is better than leaving freshly felled green timber unsealed. That's a guaranteed near total loss rate for turning blank sizes. :rolleyes:

To my mind, dipping in wax is the second most effective method, followed by dipping in paint. I haven't tried dilute PVA on sufficient varieties, in enough batches or over sufficient time to work out how it rates, but I have used it when I've nothing else to hand and I'm confident it works. I think 'tis better than paint but, as I said, I don't have enough data to say one way or t'other.

I should point out that I seal freshly felled logs on site then, when back in the shed, I split the heart out and reseal. The effectiveness of each type of sealer may - and probably does - vary if one is sealing partially or fully cured timbers to protect them from humidity changes.

Still... anything is far superior to nothing. :)

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Hi Moby and skew , thanks for your thoughts and info , :2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:

Another one that works is polystyrene foam dissolved in turps.

Makes a lovely, gooey mess but dries nicely given a bit of time. We used to use it some 40 years ago in High School Art classes for sculptures and one day I thought "why not try it?"

It had the awesome bonus of getting rid of all the bits of polystyrene rattling in my shed. :D

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Originally Posted by Skew ChiDAMN!!

Another one that works is polystyrene foam dissolved in turps.

Makes a lovely, gooey mess but dries nicely given a bit of time. We used to use it some 40 years ago in High School Art classes for sculptures and one day I thought "why not try it?"

It had the awesome bonus of getting rid of all the bits of polystyrene rattling in my shed. :D

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I think that there are far less hazardous "log end sealers" than this brew.

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Originally Posted by Mobyturns

I think that there are far less hazardous "log end sealers" than this brew.

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I also use polystyrene foam and turps,but wasn't aware that is was hazardous (unless I spilled the gooey, sticky mess down my front :oo:). Is the hazard from the polystyrene. the turps (which I know is flammable), or the combination of the two?

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Originally Posted by Gary H

I also use polystyrene foam and turps,but wasn't aware that is was hazardous (unless I spilled the gooey, sticky mess down my front :oo:). Is the hazard from the polystyrene. the turps (which I know is flammable), or the combination of the two?

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Originally Posted by Gary H

... or the combination of the two?

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is oversimplifying a very complex chain of chemical reactions.

The styrene monomers used to produce Expanded PolyStyrene (EPS) foam are definitely toxic - "The categorisation of styrene as ‘toxic’ is unequivocal because, due to its high chemical reactivity, it interacts with cell systems causing widespread metabolic damage."

However EPS itself is not yet listed as "hazardous" but is banned in many local authorities and countries abroad for a number of reasons, environmental harm as a "micro plastic" etc.

There is a growing body of evidence that strongly linking various cancers to leached residual styrene monomers from incomplete polymerization of styrene in the manufacturing process and from EPS food packaging at elevated temperatures (i.e. hot food & drink containers) etc. The manufacturing country of origin also has significance as the quality of the manufacturing process determines how complete the polymerization process is.

Dissolving EPS in a solvent for disposal or "recycling", i.e. petrol, acetone, turps, white spirit, benzene, tolulene, xylene, etc creates a cocktail of hazardous chemical "byproducts" all of which are strongly linked to cancers and almost invariably are highly flammable. Burning EPS or dissolving in solvents is not an approved disposal method.

EPS is a thermoplastic which can be recycled, via an expensive process of shredding, compaction, then melting / extrusion into pellets for re-manufacture as "hard plastic" items. The economics of recycling EPS means most goes into landfill.

Why would you chose such a hazardous "brew" of "petrochemicals" over a water based wax emulsion with relatively few hazards??

My preference will always be for wax, but NOT old candles as suggested. I tried that early in the game and candle-wax falls off as soon as the timber moves as it contains a hardener - which is why candles can stand up straight! I melt a blend of non-hardened parrafin wax with beeswax to keep it flexible so it moves with the timber. Has none of the messy issues of Mobilcer that Croc mentioned and you can pick up an old electric frypan for $5 from the tip-shop to put it in. Best long term seal I have come across!:2tsup:
I sourced a large bag of parrafin beads from our Ubeaut host many years ago and though it's getting low, there should be enough to see me out. Local beekeepers will sell you unfiltered beeswax for next to nothing - a bit more if you want clean stuff though.

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Originally Posted by TTIT

My preference will always be for wax, but NOT old candles as suggested. I tried that early in the game and candle-wax falls off as soon as the timber moves as it contains a hardener - which is why candles can stand up straight! I melt a blend of non-hardened parrafin wax with beeswax to keep it flexible so it moves with the timber. Has none of the messy issues of Mobilcer that Croc mentioned and you can pick up an old electric frypan for $5 from the tip-shop to put it in. Best long term seal I have come across!:2tsup:
I sourced a large bag of parrafin beads from our Ubeaut host many years ago and though it's getting low, there should be enough to see me out. Local beekeepers will sell you unfiltered beeswax for next to nothing - a bit more if you want clean stuff though.

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Hi ttit, thanks for your thoughts mate, will have to check them out :2tsup::2tsup::2tsup: