Sanding Clear - Im a bit unclear ?

Hi, and thankyou for reading this.

Related to my previous thread, I have a small feature piece of Queensland Walnut ( the headstock of a 1970 Maton guitar) sanded back to raw wood, ready for staining with Prooftint, lacquer clearcoats , application of a 'Maton ' transfer/decal and a few more clear coats over that.

I prefer to spray lacquer for the top clearcoats as Maton tell me there would be no reaction with their transfer/decal, and also, Ive used lacquer a lot over the years.

However, before getting that far, in using a lacquer based top clearcoats, I'm a bit unclear on the first step of using a sanding clear before applying the stain. Not so much the technique, more the compatibility with the following clear lacquer topcoats.

Ive used Feast Watson Sanding Clear (turps based) in the past, and then Prooftint stain (metho based), but the finish clear coats I used were an oil based product. But Maton's advice re the decal steers me to using lacquer this time.

My limited experience with Sanding Clear tells me I should be using a lacquer based sanding clear over the raw wood before staining and subsequent coats of clear lacquer.

Am I correct, and if so, what product should I be using ?

Thanks,

Don

Hi Don, I'm thinking you mean sanding sealer? Lacquer sanding sealer is a bit different from the Feast Watson sanding sealer. The Feast Watson is more of a 'traditional' sanding sealer, much like a coat of shellac might be used. It seals the surface so porous woods won't drink in your film forming finish but doesn't fill in the grain/pores. To do that you need a grain filler.

With lacquer sanding sealers, they are made to seal and build body quickly, so can be used as a filler as well. They'll have zinc stearate added to make sanding easier. The company producing your lacquer should be able to advise you on what brand lacquer sanding sealer to use, they'll likely make it. If you don't want the grain filled and just want a thin coating on a relatively non porous wood, you could forgo the sanding sealer.

Thank you for your reply Alkahestic. Yes, I did mean sanding sealer.

The Feast Watson product says apply their Sanding Sealer to raw wood, sand back flat and then do the stain . It seems counter-intuitive to apply stain over a sealing coat (and not direct on to the raw wood), but that's what Ive read and seen online too.

So does sanding sealer, at least the Feast Watson one, absorb stain as well as the wood under it ?

Feast Watson sanding sealers (and other wood flour sanding sealers) don't seal the wood in the normal sense of the word seal - lacquer sanding sealer is different in this regard as well. With wood flour sanding sealers, you can apply the stain after sanding down the sealer as the stain will penetrate the sealer coat. Doing it in this order will prevent/reduce any blotchiness in the stain application as the wood can't soak up uneven amounts of the stain. So if you've filled the grain, done a sanding sealer coat, then stained, you should have an even but natural looking stain application. You can even do an oil finish over the Feast Watson sealer.

With lacquer sanding sealer, once the sealer is on, any color you're applying is really a glaze over the lacquer and will look different than color straight on the wood. I can't comment more on glazing over lacquer as I've never gone down that path. I imagine that you would have to be careful with your product selection here - the manufacturer of the lacquer should have the info you need.

Don,

I don’t know details about your choice of lacquer, but I use Behlen’s Stringed Instrument Lacquer. Under this I use Behlen’s ‘Vinyl’ Sanding Sealer (which is the recommended product). Works fine for me. I buy from guitarAust - Your online “One Stop Shop” to meet your guitar building, repairing, upgrading, and finishing needs..

Brian

[QUOTE=homey;2158003]Don,

I don’t know details about your choice of lacquer, but I use Behlen’s Stringed Instrument Lacquer. Under this I use Behlen’s ‘Vinyl’ Sanding Sealer (which is the recommended product). Works fine for me. I buy from guitarAust - Your online “One Stop Shop” to meet your guitar building, repairing, upgrading, and finishing needs..

Brian[/QUOTE

Thankyou Brian. Do you apply any stain before or after applying this Vinyl sanding sealer ?
Regards,
Don

Hi Don,

Sorry, stains are a mystery to me. However, there is a very good finishing ‘flowchart’ at Stewmac and they are the experts.

Nitrocellulose Finishing Schedule | stewmac.com

Good luck,

Brian

I decided to definitely go with Wattyl Stylwood, which is a pre cat nitrocellulose lacquer. MAton confirmed that the decal/transfer will not be affected by this lacquer .

As per product instructions, I have used Wattyl Rediseal as the sanding sealer, first staining the wood with a mix of maple 80% and walnut (20%) Feast Watson Prooftint. The original almost black colour was probably a black lacquer sprayed over the original finish to hide defects.

Photo shows the headstock after 3 double coats of Rediseal, block sanding between coats after 24 hours dry time. Decal and gloss Stylwood next week.

Attachment 462793

Attachment 463443

Job done . 4 coats of 95% gloss Stylwood, and leaving well enough alone. I used Universal thinners in the rediseal and GP lacquer thinners in the stylwood gloss after reading a post. The gloss did go on well off the gun. ANd I know... the Maton transfer is a wee bit crooked !
Personal touch we'll call it.