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hi all.Just purchased a Jet 1800w benchtop thicknesser.Some advise on dust extraction would be appreciated.Scheppach model HD12 states 680 cfm ,hafco model DC2 is 500cfm,could these be adequate or am I barking up the wrong tree..I have very limited space and portability is important.Thanks in advance.
Go for at least the DC3 at 1200cfm and you have the beginnings of an extraction system. Those cfm ratings are with everything wide open so in practice you get a lot less. A little bit more money but the footprint is the same. Its best if you can place the extractor outside the work space as they all leak some dust when working.
Regards
John
Hi,
This may be hard to accept, but a commonly accepted target CFM for dust extraction is 1000cfm.
Its also commonly accepted that quote numbers are about half in real world. So when your extractor states 500cfm, expect around 250cfm in actual performance. Well short of the target cfm of 1000.
Spend some time in the dust extraction forum and familarise yourself with a 2hp model and how to modify it, because thats the most compact you'll get whilst getting close to the target cfm.
Small DCs like those you refer to will collect some chips but leave most of the fine (dangerous) dust behind.
To have a chance of collecting the fine dust, as orraloon says the minimum is a DC3 (preferably modified and optimised as shown in this thread The Generic 2HP DC). If you read more in the dust forum you will see the dust collector is only 1 of 3 important things in dust collection. The other two being; using 6" ducting AND modifying the machines to accept the 6" ducting.
If this is all too hard, and you are only an occasional old worker, then a standard DC3 with 4" ducting can be used together with some forced ventilation. This means adding some exhaust fans to continually ventilate the shed. Any forced ventilation is better than nothing but the target is 20 room air changes per hour.
Welcome to the Forum, ganti1.
Hope I don't annoy anyone, but I am going to make some suggestions that vary from the advice given above.
First, before you spend any money on dust extraction, you really need to get a handle on the science involved; then you will realise why so much that you read is just hype. The two best sources of information that I know are:
ONE: The Dust Extraction subforum of this Forum, especially the contributions by BobL, and
TWO: The writings of American guru Bill Pentz.
Dust Collection Research - Home
Most of us are initially concerned with the visible sawdust, it is a nuisance, but the real problem is the barely visible fine dust, it is seriously dangerous over time. This is the stuff that Bill and Bob are talking about. And usually in the context of a dust collection system for an entire workshop. This is a legal obligation for a professional shop, is highly desirable for a serious amateur shop; but it is expensive and may be overkill for a casual hobbyist.
Noting that you are in Brisbane, I presume that your work space has more than adequate ventillation; this should fairly quickly disperse the fine dust particles. A well placed fan or extractor could help. And a good mask is essential when making dust and after dust has been made (it lingers in the air).
You can then just concentrate on cleaning up the visible sawdust. I see a number of options, including:
- An inexpensive drum type vacuum cleaner connected to your existing thicknesser ports, (even cheaper second hand), or
- An "integrated" vacuum such as a Festool that can also be with sanders and other hand tools (significantly more expensive).
I would not recommend a 2HP or even a 3HP dusty as they do not work very well and they are not really very portable.
Please note: my suggestions bypass the fine dust issue and must be backed by good ventillation and a good mask. If you progress to the serious woodworker stage then a more elaborate system will be needed.
He still needs something to deal with the chips and a 2HP is going to be considerably better than a 1HP.Quote:
Originally Posted by GraemeCook
The 2HP DC3 is only marginally bigger than the 1HP variants.
That's why I suggested a stock 2HP and ventilation.
BTW I disagree about using mask as front line Protection. Apart from being PITA to always have to wear in a shed, in the standard hierarchy of control of risk, PPE should only be used when every other possibility has been taken or is not able to be taken.
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Thanks all for your input.My work area is part inside but mainly a covered open space I built it with the" dreadful" Brisbane weather in mind.Everything on wheels.I clearly have some reading to do .I'll definitely come up with a master plan based on everyone advice.I would take a guess most brands come out of the same factory .Suggestions on what NOT to buy ??? .
I anticipated this response from you, Bob, which is why I so qualified my initial posting.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobL
Naturally, I fully agree with the risk hierarchy in a commercial workshop or a serious amateurs shop. But it is totally unrealistic for a casual user in not factoring in the cost element. And the OP is in Brisbane so his shop probably is essentially outdoors, not enclosing the fine dust as in the southern states.
I'm in Brisbane. I have a 6x4 shed and a carport. I have almost everything on wheels and spend a lot of the time working in the carport. Even the dust collector is on wheels and can be rolled out into the carport. I roll my assembly table out and put my lunch box thicknesser on it. I never use that beast inside the shed. However the thicknesser still needs a dust extractor to work properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by ganti1
Also many times you just have 40 minutes free to do something on a project. If you spend 10 minutes moving the car and rolling out machines then the same 10 minutes to put it all back, this 40 minutes becomes 20 minutes - you are just not going to bother. The reality is that you are going to go into your shed and make those 4 cuts on machines inside - because it will only take you a few minutes. It's the reality. In that time invisible dust will fill your small shed and enter your lungs.
Plus in my case the carport is on a slope and is very uneven ground and so I can't realistically use some machines out there.
So working in the carport is very helpful but it's only part of the picture.
I would note 3 things.
1. Do that reading that has been talked about above.
2. Understand that the dust collector machine is the cheap part of an entire system. You probably wont believe that until you properly look into all this.
3. Forced ventilation is only helpful when it blows out of your shed. That is, it's ability to suck air outwards. Blowing air around your work area makes it worse not better. Plus forced ventilation is secondary (an add-on) for dust that made it into the air. Primary is dust collection at the point dust is being made.
In my case, I take an evolutionary approach to the whole topic. That is, that my dust management system is never "complete". It is always a work in progress. There is always the next improvement on the to do list. Bit by bit, it gets better.
Second BobL's and Dave's inputs
The biggest issue I found with using a respirator as your primary means of safety is it quickly becomes unsafe when you're using it as its obviously designed to filter (read collect) dust. Which means unless you're ontop of your cleaning/maintenance/replacement of filters it eventually becomes a the very hazard you're trying to eliminate.
Dust collection even for a hobbiest who spends minimal time in the shed is a must have. As even if you don't believe dust will have any negative effects on your well being, the biggest advantage of having a well planned dust collection system is not having to clean up the mess you've made by not having a collector. This has obvious flow on benefits such as having a cleaner workspace, reduces the number of hazards in your workspace, keeps your neighbours and family safe and most importantly you can put that nasty broom away. Having a dust collector also doubles as a vacuum cleaner and significantly increases any mess left behind.
A 2hp dusty is quite portable, but having it in a fixed location venting outside has significant advantages too.