Lidded Box no. 6

[jefferson]

Here is the latest offering:.

Attachment 109375

Attachment 109376

Attachment 109377

Attachment 109378

The piece started out as 90mm round, but ended up much smaller - 83mm - after I had a serious catch with the skew. I should know better by now....The shape was almost right. The other one is Box no. 5.

The base needed more off the last angle on the foot. The top also needed a more gradual transition too. Also, I sanded the base to 1200 grit but not so with the top. A good learning experience though. And the top doesn't fit nice and snug either.

I had some problems hollowing without the tools I need - I just didn't know how thin I should aim for with Camphor Laurel. And I didn't hollow correctly (I think) down to the arc of the foot.? I stopped the curve short and it feels bottom heavy.

The plans for this style of box are not good. That is, the plans direct that you shape both the base and top of the piece, then part off the lid. Not a good approach using Shellawax when you need speed for the finish on the under-side of the top. (I haven't worked out how to chuck the lid thus far. )

I learnt a good deal with this one.

Don't cut the inside rim until last, as sanding the inside makes the lid fit loose.

Also, stick with one spindle gouge. The experts no doubt can alternate between chisels with different profiles/ bevels, but beginners like me need to stick with just one.

But most of all, I must learn how to cut the lid correctly. I had "jump catch" one after the other - and the top should be slighty wider than the base.

Open as always for thoughts / criticism.

The Kitchen QA controller has thankfully agreed to assess my "best effort" Chinese box (thanks Helen, but don't hold your breath.) QA here is hard too.

I'll do another 5 or 10 or 20 in the same vein until I get it right.

And Skew, I must definitely be in front of my target of one box a week. I'll do another tomorrow out of redgum (with a loose fit) and learn some more....

Jeff

[RETIRED]

Not as nice a shape as 5.

The base is too high and wide.

As you already know the curve from the base is too sharp which has pushed the transition line too high but I know the trouble you had with this one.

The lid IMHO should have been a more concave shape but that is personal preference.

The finish is getting really good Jeff.

Wall thickness on most timbers at that size can go extremely thin.

[orificiam]

Nice Box Jeff.if I could change one thing I'd make the foot shorter or no foot at all
But that's just me.Beautiful finish BTW.
Cheers Tony.

[mick61]

G`day Jeff that`s not a bad effort considering it`s box number 6. Shape isn`t bad you should sand with the grain especially the top and you will get a much better finish. My other tip would be if you sand and burnish to 600etc on the top you must do the same on every other aspect ie inside outside bottom. You can jam chuck the top to finish inside or do in stages so you finish the inside of the lid first then the outside(or top) when you jam chuck it on to the base.If that doe`sn`t make sense let me know.
Mick

[jefferson]

Thanks, .

You didn't have to call to forewarn me of your feedback. That's why I put the piece up in the first place.

Thanks anyway, your pre-emptive call before you posted was a nice touch. Sums you up, doesn't it?

You must explain to me about the transition line.

Remember please that I am a mere Grasshopper. I am ready to learn - and the Kitchen QA Officer (AKA Helen) has agreed to QA my work when I think I'm "ready". That's another 10-20 boxes based on this design. (I'm not moving onto the next design until I think my work passes muster).

I knew the base / foot was wrong as soon as I parted it off the lathe. I kept tilting my head to the vertical and got a little dizzy. I was also a little worried about the glue-hold. But I can fix the base with a jam chuck (I hope anyway).

Same problem with the lid, but for different reasons. I had a nice concave curve flowing at one stage (an easy cut for me, just like turning coves). The main problem came when I made the entry cuts on that sharp edge on the lid. Then I ruined it.

I think I had the bevel pointing in the right direction, left thumb on the rest blocking the chisel from moving left. Turning right handed too. But the chisel still jumped left and the box lid kept getting smaller and smaller and even more shallow....

Also, the lid should overhang the base - and it doesn't.

A good learning experience. I just need to learn from the mistakes. I hurried No. 6 a little, as Skew was onto me and my schedule. (Well, not quite true. I've set myself a target on quantity but I must also consider quality too).

I'm still in front and will start another box tomorrow.

(I also learnt today that dig-ins on softwood are a lot less forgiving than redgum!) That is, the dig-ins are deeper!

Any and all suggestions welcome. I'm here to play and learn. I hope that I take your criticisms well.

And I'll continue to post my pics of my boxes as a way of recording my progress. And not just for mebut for those out there that are helping me along the journey. I hope you can see some improvement in my turning over time.

Jeff

[Calm]

Thanks, .

You didn't have to call to forewarn me of your feedback. That's why I put the piece up in the first place.

Thanks anyway, your pre-emptive call before you posted was a nice touch. Sums you up, doesn't it?

.........................................

Jeff

So if i want to say it is shyte house thats OK then

















No Jeff i think you are getting better although i do prefer the shape of the 5th one. My preference is for a fitted lid as apposed to the overhanging "asian hut" look

[jefferson]

Thanks guys for the feedback.

I don't have a good handle (yet) on chucking lids where you form both the top and bottom together, then part the top off. Particularly when the lid has such a sharp apron as it does with the Chinese Hat box.

But the approach seems more preferable than turning the inside of the lid first ie the Raffan method, then finishing the lid jamned onto the base. I prefer to see what the outside looks like first, then turn the inside to suit.

Execution is another matter....

As for you Calm..... You'll keep.

I do agree, I don't particularly like the lid. But it is a good starting point for me and a "not-too-hard" project for Box no 6. The hat certainly disguises any break-line between the top and base.

BTW, I don't think Box 6 was a step backwards from Box 5. It wasn't executed as well but it was a different box out of different wood, turned 1 day apart.

Tell me though as loud and as long as you like if Box 15 is no better.

Jeff

[mick61]

Jeff that`s why you turn the inside of the lid then jam it on the base.Then you can alter the base to suit the lid.
Mick

[jefferson]

Mick, you were very quickly onto me on this one.

The few boxes I have turned previously, I did as you suggest.

But I saw Ken W. do it the other way around and it made a lot of sense to me. That is, you turn the entire box, part the lid, then hollow the lid and the base. At least you get a full picture of the box all together from the outside first. You are not turning blind.

The problem is hollowing the lid. I didn't have to do that with the last two boxes, but I need to learn how to do it otherwise.

Yep, the solution is in finding how to hold the lid for hollowing. Just another little adventure. IMHO of course (all this from a guy with 6 boxes under his belt!)

Jeff

[mick61]

No worries Jeff ask Ken W about his ken chuck I saw it on saturday.
Mick

P.S.Hi Ken hope I am not giveing too much away.
Enjoyed Saturday

[KenW]

No worries Jeff ask Ken W about his ken chuck I saw it on saturday.
Mick

P.S.Hi Ken hope I am not giveing too much away.
Enjoyed Saturday

Mick, glad you enjoyed Saturday. I got a bit tired by the end, must be getting old.
Give away all the tips you can. I don't mind.
I havn't answered Jeff here, as I emailed a set of instruction direct to him, when I read his post.
We will see what box 7 turns out like.

[jefferson]

Mick,

The Ken Chuck will test me on this one. I think my VM 120 chuck may do it, maybe.

Ken W. has also sent me detailed instructions that I will post (if Ken is OK with that) after I get Box no. 15 right.

I'm quite determined now with this Chinese Hat box.

Not only do I want to turn a decent Chinese Hat box, I want to make it better. And that means hollowing the lid. (The instructions say that you simply part the lid off and that's all).

I am thinking there are a few options here - assuming that I want to turn all of the outside of the box first, then hollow:

- use the Ken W. Chuck, great for solid edges on the lid but perhaps a little dicey with sharp edges
- use the bowl jaws, but on a much smaller scale. (4 plates attached to the standard bowl jaws, faced off, then additional faceplates attached. You simply part at say 120mm and insert your bowl or lid with none of your fingers in danger).

I will give it some more thought in the morning after I re-read Ken W's instructions.

In my mind, I can see no way of getting a box exactly right unless you turn the outside first. How you hollow the mirror image insde is the hard part. Sure, you don't need a finial on the inside of the lid, but how can you get the shape you want if you start on the outside?

More tomorrow. Probably another bin job, but I will be trying.

Jeff

[artme]

Can't say any more than has already been said, but want to comment on the good finish.

[tea lady]

Love 'em. I didn't realise box number 5 was so small. I'm a sucker for small things. Box 5 has a nicer squashier form, but you know that already. Onward and upward.

[Woodwould]

Box 5 is the little red one in the picture above? I think it looks fantastic!

I'm going to be turning some intricate little utensils from Apple shortly, so I'm interested in how you form the lids from the same stock as the body, yet make the lids hollow.

My thinking is that I'll hollow the lid from the end of the stock, then part it off, hollow and turn the body, press the lid on and then turn the exterior of the lid. Is that what you box makers do? The only issue I can see with this method is that the grain continuity will be interrupted - but then, there's always going to be a substantial interruption anyway due to the lid's spigot.

Sorry for the hi-jack - , feel free to move this to a new thread or delete it.