Thread: know anything of Paulownia timber ?

Jake

Seriously, the stuff I have used is like balsa. You would not want it in anything structural that has to take stresses. Certainly not a chair. It is much softer and less dense than any pine you can name. It makes Radiata look like a hardwood!

Regards from Perth

Derek

Lite as Balsa, dents with a thumbnail with ease, but structurally, pound for pound, one of the strongest timbers available. Unbelievably strong. But unfortunately it’s a very plain and ugly timber. Used for shutters, coffins and fitting out caravans and motor homes. Jake, pass on it for your seats. Strong enough, but soft and ugly.

ok. thankyou for your time.. I'll skip it. denting it with your finger tip would bother me plenty. probably ding up heavily before it even gets to sale.

Originally Posted by Lignum

Lite as Balsa, dents with a thumbnail with ease, but structurally, pound for pound, one of the strongest timbers available. Unbelievably strong. But unfortunately it’s a very plain and ugly timber. Used for shutters, coffins and fitting out caravans and motor homes. Jake, pass on it for your seats. Strong enough, but soft and ugly.

I agree with most of your comments. Add surfboards and kayaks etc.
It is said that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Depending on how the timber is cut and the size of the original log the grain is far from plain and most people of my customers do not regard it as an ugly timber but rather the opposite.

John

Originally Posted by derekcohen

Hi Jake

Paulownia is as light as balsa and as soft, if the stuff I've used is representative. Mine was a bugger to handplane (like planing a wooly jumper), the grain was boring as can be, and frankly the only reason I built some stuff out of it was that it came from a tree we took down in the garden.

In the East it is prized for boxes for knives, chisels and furniture. No accounting for taste.

The stuff grows like a weed and is like the relative that you cannot get rid of. We spent forever trying to kill the bloody tree. It had grown twice the size of the house and was still not even a teenager. It spent its time sending roots around the garden and popping up like the periscope from a submarine. At full moon we danced around it and chanted. Eventually our curses prevailed and it went. Thank God!

Plantations are grown because it is easy to grow - quick and cheap. It is quite stable. It dries quickly. It should be a cheap wood to buy. It grows on trees.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek

Sorry but I have to set the record straight on a few points in your comments.

First Balsa has a density of 128kg per cm, Paulownia is 288kg per cm and for the comparison WRC is 384kg per cm. Paulownia's strengh to weight ratio is the highest.
Second To work Paulownia you must have sharp tools otherwise what happened to you with your plane will occur.
Third If you had painted the stump as soon as you had cut it down with some strong roundup or something similar it would have died no problem.
Fourth If grown as a garden specimen it is true what you said. If grown for plantation timber then it is farmed intensely. By this I mean pruned to get and maintain trunk height, fertilised, total weed control within 1.5 m of the tree and slashing between the rows. This is time consuming and this cost has to be recovered in the end product. That is why it is not a cheap timber.

Whitewood

One comment I would make I was told buy a grower from Glenreagh several years ago that trees grown up on the New England Tablelands that the timber is slower growing and is bit denser. Now this may be a load of crap but just a comment from a grower.

thanks Barry. I think everything helps. and John for the info.

uno, I wouldn't be surprised if it can be made to work in a lot of windsor chair designs. Milk paint can be used to colour or stain the wood anyway if the colours a bother. sounds like it would be structurally fine. maybe a bit of a worry on sharp corners of the seat blank. But it definetly keep the chair light which is good. the only thing that bothers me is it dinging up quickly. sounds like all it take is some bloke to sit down and leave a mark from a button on the back of his jeans.

the plantation bloke said he'd give me a bit to try. if he does i'll make up a little stool and see what happens. let you know if you guys are interested.

Hi Barry

In reply to a few of your points ..

First Balsa has a density of 128kg per cm, Paulownia is 288kg per cm and for the comparison WRC is 384kg per cm. Paulownia's strengh to weight ratio is the highest.

To the uninformed user (that is, one without technical information), Paulownia feels as light as Balsa. It is nearly as soft as Balsa. Ergo one might assume that they are similar. I built a few boxes out of the wood I had, and it was not pleasant to work. I was not inspired to persevere with larger pieces.

Second To work Paulownia you must have sharp tools otherwise what happened to you with your plane will occur.

Yeah, right. I always work with blunt handplanes!

I do believe that I know one end of a blade from another ..

Somewhere on this website there are pictures of me handplaning the boards.

Third If you had painted the stump as soon as you had cut it down with some strong roundup or something similar it would have died no problem.

Mate, we did this. The tree was removed by a professional company. We poured gallons of Roundup on the bloody thing. It was plain oppositional - it just refused to die. And then it thumbed its nose at us by sprouting up all over the show!

Fourth If grown as a garden specimen it is true what you said. If grown for plantation timber then it is farmed intensely. By this I mean pruned to get and maintain trunk height, fertilised, total weed control within 1.5 m of the tree and slashing between the rows. This is time consuming and this cost has to be recovered in the end product. That is why it is not a cheap timber.

That I can believe.

Look, more seriously, I recognise that there is a place for timber like Paulownia. I am sure that it would be great for boats and surfboards. However my experience was not a positive one. I was not inspired to use the timber for anything more than boring utlity boxes for the workshop.

Boring box #1 ..



Boring box #2 ..



Boring box #3 ..







Regards from Perth

Derek

I'm not sure how exciting a box can be Derek. I don't mind that grain in boring box 2. Think if you find it boring then maybe the design should be improved. And if its not responding to handplanes then run it through your thickness sander if things need to be kept flat.

For a chair the shaping can be done with grit to finish off so doesn't matter about blade sharpeness etc or flatness. So there'd be no problem in working the stuff.

I think it should be remembered he's got a plantation of the stuff, and he's been good about the details.

Tansu are often made of Kiri/Paulownia. I would like to tackle making one some day. I think the grain shows off well in this furntiture. However the grain as seen in an example such is this seems to be quite different to Derek's boxes.

Perhaps the stuff in the Japanese furniture is quarter sawn or maybe the plantation stuff in Aus is a different variety?

Originally Posted by derekcohen

Mate, we did this. The tree was removed by a professional company. We poured gallons of Roundup on the bloody thing. It was plain oppositional - it just refused to die. And then it thumbed its nose at us by sprouting up all over the show!

Derek
Perhaps it was the 'company'. The Power company who services this area has removed a few of my paulownias from under power lines. They made me paint the stump with their roundup[, so if it was my fault if nearby trees died, and only the intended trees have died. I used a paint brush and only gave them one coat. I have used this process on a camphour laurels to only poision several large succors and then the whole tree has died. I use a mix of 1 part roundup to 8 parts water.

For the record I was not suggesting you can't sharpen tools. It was more that if the tool has been used before it may have lost the fine edge necessary to work paulownia especially across the grain.

I won't get into a debate on the issue of paulownia. I will defend it if members state incorrect information about it. For my part everybody is entitled to there opinion and beauty is in the eye ........ I thought one of your boxes was very impressive and deserved better treatment than housing bits and pieces in your workshop.

Whitewood

Originally Posted by Fuzzie

Tansu are often made of Kiri/Paulownia. I would like to tackle making one some day. I think the grain shows off well in this furntiture. However the grain as seen in an example such is this seems to be quite different to Derek's boxes.

Perhaps the stuff in the Japanese furniture is quarter sawn or maybe the plantation stuff in Aus is a different variety?

Tansu will often be finished in black lacquer - so interesting grain is not needed!

And as Jake said, Windsor chairs often have milk paint applied so the grain may not be so important!

Originally Posted by Fuzzie

Tansu are often made of Kiri/Paulownia. I would like to tackle making one some day. I think the grain shows off well in this furntiture. However the grain as seen in an example such is this seems to be quite different to Derek's boxes.

Perhaps the stuff in the Japanese furniture is quarter sawn or maybe the plantation stuff in Aus is a different variety?

Fuzzie,

I agree the grain is different. I can't explain it and don't know about the appearance of timber from other species of paulownia. To me it looks more like it was back sawn. Derek's box appeared to be from quarter sawn timber. Sorry I can not be of more help

Whitewood

Originally Posted by apricotripper

uno, I wouldn't be surprised if it can be made to work in a lot of windsor chair designs. Milk paint can be used to colour or stain the wood anyway if the colours a bother. sounds like it would be structurally fine. maybe a bit of a worry on sharp corners of the seat blank. But it definetly keep the chair light which is good. the only thing that bothers me is it dinging up quickly. sounds like all it take is some bloke to sit down and leave a mark from a button on the back of his jeans.

Jake. The main drawback using it for your chair seats is it will devalue your product. Windsor chairs command a high dollar like you know, and if the buyer was to find Paulownia out was used in the seat, I doubt very much their would be a sale.