Thread: Waterstone difficulties again.....

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

The problem with the spray glue is that the propellant is inconsistent

Indeed, and small lumps of glue can sometimes be seen. To counter this as best i can, I use a graphic artists burnishing roller to spread out the abrasive sheet on the granite. Fix the leading edge and then a gentle run up the middle and work it out to the edges from there. Then some heavy duty rolling in two different dimensions.

I don't know if this helps, but I use W&D on a glass plate. Instead of gluing it down, I have the glass set above the block it is sitting in by about 4-6mm. I screw long sides down, one side first, and the other so that it pulls the paper taut. I don't like the potential uneveness of the glue.
It's a bit more fiddly but it works for me.
Here is a crappy pic, in case you don't follow:W&D.jpg
That pic is so bad, even I can't see it.
If anyone wants a clearer pic, ask.
TM

Originally Posted by TermiMonster

I don't know if this helps, but I use W&D on a glass plate. Instead of gluing it down, I have the glass set above the block it is sitting in by about 4-6mm. I screw long sides down, one side first, and the other so that it pulls the paper taut. I don't like the potential uneveness of the glue.
It's a bit more fiddly but it works for me.
Here is a crappy pic, in case you don't follow:W&D.jpg
That pic is so bad, even I can't see it.
If anyone wants a clearer pic, ask.
TM

TM

That's another good solution. I'm sure Brett could figure out a toggle clamp arrangement instead of the screws, which would be the fiddly bit.

So we have Ern's water technique, Brett's rolling of the glue and TM's clamping arrangement.

BTW, if you click on the drawing it enlarge to become easy to see.

Regards
Paul

There was a thread on here some time ago showing a different re-usable product to fix the paper down, it was some sort of re-usable glue meant for the purpose. Apart from that I think everyone tries a few sharpening methods and eventually settles on one for whatever reason. I can quite well imagine Brett not liking water stones as they are messy and I don't think Brett likes messy, I certainly don't and while I have some I use them rarely for that reason.

I find my Worksharp is the answer for me after going through many different ways including oil stones, W&D paper, slow wet grinder (went to the tip) etc. I would buy a Worksharp before a grinder given the choice, grinders are generally only used once if a blade or iron needs cutting at a different angle or is badly damaged with chipping and with good tools such as Brett has it would get little use. A worksharp on the other hand sharpens, hones and polishes really well on a blade that requires it during a job which is what most of us do. Unless you are in the habit of buying used tools which need a lot of work to rehabilitate them a grinder is not really necessary as the angles are already ground when purchased. A worksharp will change an angle but it is a fairly slow process and a grinder would be better. If the GTG is early next year I will bring mine along but I have to have extended medical treatment this year and won't be going anywhere before Christmas I don't think.

Lapping is the most demanding of an abrasive & it's worth looking at sheets other than W&D which wear rapidly - emery, Alox and the 3M films. I don't favour cloth backed stuff because of the potential for varying compression.

Tougher steels warrant sheets like Norton 3X or ceramics. There are coarse WS discs in one of these that take off steel like a bench grinder.

The pimpling problem seems most acute with polyester backed sheets that don't flex like other backings.

As an aside folk who like sheet abrasive on a flat carrier should look at the Woodpecker honing plates for which coarser sheets can be cut up.

Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

I will be getting a bench grinder at some point soon - next time I go to Sydney I guess.

It's still under my coffee table!

Originally Posted by fletty

It's still under my coffee table!

Errrr, that would be the vise (I hope), but good to know that whatever it is, it's still there.

Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

Errrr, that would be the vise (I hope), but good to know that whatever it is, it's still there.

I see you have expanded your shed or at least the storage area.

I'm quite satisfied to let gravity do the work = a strip of masking tape at one end of the abrasive sheet and _nothing_ underneath.
Judging by the quality of the reflections that I can see in the granite slab surface, I have do desire to distort that with an indeterminate
amount of unevenly distributed adhesive.
At present, I have the adhesive sheets arranged on the stone like a flip-chart display. As I make extensive use of spoke shaves, this
set-up is satisfactory and compact.

Originally Posted by Robson Valley

. As I make extensive use of spoke shaves, this
set-up is satisfactory and compact.

I use spokeshaves mostly as well.

For spokeshaves I feel….

- that flatness for the backs is not as crucial as some plane blades and chisels … So a reasonably flat back is fine as long as the tips to a high grit.

- the most economical/efficient method for the bevels I've found is grinder and hard felt grinder wheel. Having a good rest for both. If the edge is out of straight run it vertical on a flat stone to put a little flat on it, then straight to the grinder off the rest….to burr the edge straight (grind a little more on the little flats at the tip)….then straight to the buffing wheel with the rest set to give a sharpening angle slightly higher than the grind angle so it buffs just at the last 1-2mm of the bevel….this throws the burr….then just back off on a high grit waterstone. (say 6000)

Best way to sharpen these blades IMO. The fastest and cheapest way. Diamond stones are good, but cost too much.

Its just an opinion. Obvious thing to say, but must say anyway. I'm not a professional sharpening expert trying to give sharpening expert advice to professional sharpening experts within earshot who I don't even know. Who maybe normally wouldn't give a shiiite , except for some noisy/selfrighteous friend/relative blowing it up. These ideas are applicable to me. Not necessarily good for you.

I'm certainly no "professional" but I do need to keep my spoke shaves tuned up for the Kitchen Tool Project.
I still sell those.
I'd rather say that I'm consistent and competent to make a useful result. Every time.
To get a reasonably round handle from a squarish blank, I actually count the strokes on each corner.
Given the length, then, crude math tells me that I have pulled my spokeshaves about 2km in birch.

For tune-ups on W&D 1500 and honing with chrome green, I have a 14" aluminum stick with a short bolt
near one end to attach the little S/S blade. True square, etc., doesn't matter. But my fingertip pressure
seems adequate to keep the abrasion fairly even. I've already painted the bevel with black felt marker
so I know by direct observation that it works rather well. Freehand, the stick makes holding a 28 degree angle quite easy.
Why 28? Both Samonas came that way. Knowing so little about the nuances of fine woodworking
I concluded that there must be a reason so I stuck with it!
At approx $15 each, they beat the complete Hello out of the $50 Stanley Crapshave.

Originally Posted by Robson Valley

I'm certainly no "professional" but I do need to keep my spoke shaves tuned up for the Kitchen Tool Project.
I still sell those.
I'd rather say that I'm consistent and competent to make a useful result. Every time.
To get a reasonably round handle from a squarish blank, I actually count the strokes on each corner.
Given the length, then, crude math tells me that I have pulled my spokeshaves about 2km in birch.

For tune-ups on W&D 1500 and honing with chrome green, I have a 14" aluminum stick with a short bolt
near one end to attach the little S/S blade. True square, etc., doesn't matter. But my fingertip pressure
seems adequate to keep the abrasion fairly even. I've already painted the bevel with black felt marker
so I know by direct observation that it works rather well. Freehand, the stick makes holding a 28 degree angle quite easy.
Why 28? Both Samonas came that way. Knowing so little about the nuances of fine woodworking
I concluded that there must be a reason so I stuck with it!
At approx $15 each, they beat the complete Hello out of the $50 Stanley Crapshave.

Sounds good. Each to there own. And I remember enjoying a post you made before about finishing old timber .I thought it was good advice.

I apologise if I gave the wrong impression. I wasn't suggesting anything in regards to you ! I don't even know you. You come across as a nice guy with a similar interest.

I try to put some kind of little disclaimer at the end of everything I write now days, because of dramas its caused me in the past, because as you'd know, it being a public forum, anyone can read it. Something I don't fully understand as I don't actively search out gossip/dirt on other people.

As a result of living in a small town, I've been labeled someone who thinks himself a ……..builder, architect, chef, professional sharpening expert etc etc, all because I don't socialise much and voice my opinion on stuff that makes sense to me occasionally on the internet. Blowen up assumptions from nothing….all due to meddling souls embellishing things to make dirt. The real troublemakers because they just can't mind …there... own ...business.

So, that bold stuff at the end of my post wasn't directed at you. It moreso directly at noisy meddlers who don't contribute, and then try to normalise there meddling habits by drawing others into it.

cheers
Jake


Its just an opinion. I'm not an expert on those people who like to empower themselves with gossip and the influence it gives them. 2 cents worth.

Hell. no, apricotripper. Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead. Life is too short to wash rags.
I am a wood carving club of one. For 8+ years. I can only explain what I have
learned by bouncing off the walls and doing experiments. The overall result is that I can consistently
obtain a satisfactory solution.

If everybody, who has to work out of town, comes home for a weekend, we might hit 500 in this village.

By myself, it has taken some considerably time to unravel some sharpening and carving puzzles.
I'd like to shorten any newcomer's journey if any of my descriptions make any sort of shortcuts.

The buzzcuts, meddlers and naysayers can bite me.