F17 for furniture problem

**jon46089** · 18th February 2008, 11:52 PM

I recall reading in the forums lots about using F17 structural KD in furniture applications and I was going to refresh before posting, but for some reason a search for “F17” now produces zilch? Has something happened to the search engine? The Google search option was so much better than default search but it also seems to have disappeared?

Anyway, over some time I have successfully experimented bit by bit with F17 for bench tops and other furniture applications. The local hardware store maintains a really nice grade of F17 and don’t mind me searching for select pieces, i.e. nice grain, without knots and unsightly sap etc. In addition to nice appearance there has not been any long term warping or other imperfection. Evidently the local hardware store F17 is adequately Kiln Dried as well. Needless to say the advantage of F17 is the cost saving over “furniture” grade, which can be as large as a factor of 4 or 5.

Based on these results, I have started an ambitious project to build a 5m wide x 2.5 m high “bookshelf wall” using F17 as the decorative (fluted edges) structural members. Several years ago I was fortunate to salvage KD bookshelves from an old library that was being demolished, but all 19-22mm thickness (another story). So the design needs four 5.4m lengths of 240 x 45 F17 for the bookshelf structure. This will be planed down to 35 mm using a thicknesser.

The local hardware store was stripped out for the bench top and some nice looking F17 was found at Tile Importers (Huntingdale, Melbourne). They won’t cut, so selected pieces were packed early in the morning for delivery at the end of the day.

I was really p…d off to discover the uppermost length developed severe cupping, e.g. 15 mm over the 240 mm width. Today was 34 deg C in Melbourne and evidently the timber sat out in the hot sun all day. All pieces have now been placed under cover, stored horizontally and packed to allow for lots of air circulation.

The delivery guy suggested leaving the badly cupped piece out in the sun tomorrow, but with opposite side up. He claims this will neutralize the effect on the other side. Is this a good idea or will it make things worse? Obviously I don’t want to go through labor of building highly visible bookshelves that end up being a warped distorted mess. So is the gross cupping evidence of high moisture content? If so, then how long should it be left to dry out? Or should I approach this scientifically by getting a moisture reading?

**manoftalent** · 19th February 2008, 12:00 AM

I have in the past done as suggested and turned the bad piece over and it did work ok ......but when it does "right" itself be sure to store it properly right away .......or it will continue to warp ......another words ....keep checking through the day to see how much warp has deminished .....and store in a cool place as soon as it looks ok ....or the process just keeps going ....

**Ron Dunn** · 19th February 2008, 12:04 AM

240mm sounds very ambitious, unless very piece is quarter sawn across its entire width. Unlikely, I think, which is wny you are getting cupping.

A safer option is to choose smaller boards with vertical grain in the end section (clearly quarter sawn) and glue them together to make a wider panel/board.

**jon46089** · 19th February 2008, 06:06 AM

Thanks for quick replies.

Pieces have been cut to length so the "counter warp" method for the other side can be tried using a short test piece.
But does the warping mean the timber is likely to have a high moisture content in the first place?
Can it be trusted now, or does it need to dry out more?

As Ron suggests the 240mm width is pretty ambitious.
Although a previous successful (still flat after a year) bench top used 3 pieces glued together, even though one of the pieces was 190mm wide.
I guess one of the reasons F17 is cheaper than furniture timber is that it is flat sawn rather than quarter sawn.
So while using narrow quarter sawn pieces might be better it would end up being more expensive and more laborious with all the gluing
Besides, I kind of like the appearance of the grain in flat-sawn timber.

Time to wait and watch and think a bit more about it for a while.
Hopefully it doesn't end up being expensive firewood.

**glock40sw** · 19th February 2008, 07:15 AM

G'day.
Once the piece has been exposed to the sun on the lower face, flattening will occur. once the cupping has abated, the moisture content will need equalising. do this by storing for 2 weeks in covered area with good air flow. M.C. should equalise to the insitu EMC.

**Fuzzie** · 19th February 2008, 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by jon46089

The Google search option was so much better than default search but it also seems to have disappeared?

You can always search directly from google. In the search box type in your search term then add site:www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au at the end. This will restrict the google search engine to only look at the forum website.

**manoftalent** · 19th February 2008, 01:27 PM

yes I agree ...definately needs to be dried more ....maybe someone in your area has a moisture meter ....it'll take all the guessing out ...cool air flow is important though and use plenty of battens say 300mm apart or it will warp

**DJ’s Timber** · 19th February 2008, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by jon46089

Has something happened to the search engine? The Google search option was so much better than default search but it also seems to have disappeared?

The Google search bar is still there but is only available from the U-Beauts skin.

If you go to the bottom left of the screen

, you should see a dropdown box with will most likely have "wiki-blog default", change this to "U-Beauts" and the search bar will be available via that skin

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