Thread: New 4 jaw chuck.

Originally Posted by Alaks McGREGORE

Hi, I have decided what type of lathe to get (the al-250g) thanks to all the lovely people that responded to my other thread. Now I am going to look at what parts to get, I am going to buy a 4 jaw independent chuck but don't know what one to get. I was thinking of getting a 8" chuck, is that the right size? Also if you could tell me what tipe of tailstock chuck to get, MT3 I think.

Alaks, Well done, I am sure you will get a lot of enjoyment out of it. I think the 8" would be too big for your lathe. Hare and Forbes sell a 5" 4 jaw set up for the AL250G so you don't have to make a mounting plate first up while you are still gaining experience.

See here https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/L151

I would try to buy the chuck with the lathe and they might give you a bit of a discount. Also their November sale is not that far away and they may have a special on then.

As far as tail stock chucks go, they seem to be few and far between. I have had my eye on this one for a while
Revolving Live Center Chuck 3MT 65mm 3 JAW Chuck | eBay It has an MT3 taper which will fit your lathe. But if you are going to just get a drill chuck, I'd go for a 16mm keyed chuck and buy the correct arbor that will fit the chuck and have an MT3 taper. I'd get one with a tang on the end. You will probably need to grind the tang down so that the chuck will seat well into the tailstock so you get full travel but still long enough to eject it from the tailstock, Don't do what I did and cut it right off as then it is too short to eject so I had to pull the tailstock apart AND buy a new arbor! A chuck like that will do you for a long time. The keyless chucks are quite long (and more expensive) so they can eat into the bed space.

As far as other tools go, it depends if you want to use carbide tips or not. I decided I had enough to learn without grinding my own tooling. From experience, don't get the 7 piece insert tooling kit H&F sell, they are not very good. Bite the bullet and buy one of the 3 piece kits that use ISO inserts. eg. https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/L451

You will get much better prices at a place like CTC tools in Hong Kong but you need to understand how to decode the ISO codes or risk purchasing the wrong insert.

Probably, the only other thing you might consider is a live centre but the dead centres that will come with it will get you by for a while.

If you have not been to Hare and Forbes, I would recommend you go in person to buy your lathe as you will probably screw some extras out of them on the day. The salesman promised me 10% off on any tooling I buy and has been true to his word... Hit them up for a bottle of lathe oil...

Finally, the stands that come with the lathes are not very stable. If you buy one, you must bolt it down to stop this happening which has prompted me to make a new lathe stand for my lathe. Hopefully, I will get it finished this weekend.

The Tailstock taper is listed as M/T 3,you could use either a M/T 1,2 or 3 chuck,if you use the 1 or 2 you would need a M/T sleeve to suit your tailstock.

A 125mm/5" chuck is listed as an accessory to this lathe,if you wanted to run bigger you would need to be able to either make or buy a suitable backing plate,you may find that larger than 125mm/5" maybe too heavy/big for the size lathe,not that you can't use a bigger chuck if you wanted.

Hi Alaks,

I agree with the for-posters. I find just a keyed 13mm 3MT chuck in the tailstock is plenty.
The stand is solid enough, but bolt it down and make sure plenty of silicone around the feet of the lathe bed before fitting it onto the tray - stops leaking into the cabinet.
I also agree that you need to negotiate the best deal you can for yourself. If you agree to pay the full price for the lathe, ask them to firstly throw in a 4-jaw for nix, then ask them to add a good discount on the rest (tools & holders etc).

I mentioned in your other thread that found my 250G in the H&F throwout aisle for 1/2 price - they still gave me lots of the other stuff well discounted. Tell them you have a 50 year machining life ahead and will be therefore GOOD for H&F in the long term!

Always remember when negotiating, everyone will always sell something to you if they want to. Good Luck.

Daryl

Originally Posted by rodweb

Alaks, Well done, I am sure you will get a lot of enjoyment out of it. I think the 8" would be too big for your lathe. Hare and Forbes sell a 5" 4 jaw set up for the AL250G so you don't have to make a mounting plate first up while you are still gaining experience.

See here https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/L151

I would try to buy the chuck with the lathe and they might give you a bit of a discount. Also their November sale is not that far away and they may have a special on then.

As far as tail stock chucks go, they seem to be few and far between. I have had my eye on this one for a while
Revolving Live Center Chuck 3MT 65mm 3 JAW Chuck | eBay It has an MT3 taper which will fit your lathe. But if you are going to just get a drill chuck, I'd go for a 16mm keyed chuck and buy the correct arbor that will fit the chuck and have an MT3 taper. I'd get one with a tang on the end. You will probably need to grind the tang down so that the chuck will seat well into the tailstock so you get full travel but still long enough to eject it from the tailstock, Don't do what I did and cut it right off as then it is too short to eject so I had to pull the tailstock apart AND buy a new arbor! A chuck like that will do you for a long time. The keyless chucks are quite long (and more expensive) so they can eat into the bed space.

As far as other tools go, it depends if you want to use carbide tips or not. I decided I had enough to learn without grinding my own tooling. From experience, don't get the 7 piece insert tooling kit H&F sell, they are not very good. Bite the bullet and buy one of the 3 piece kits that use ISO inserts. eg. https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/L451

You will get much better prices at a place like CTC tools in Hong Kong but you need to understand how to decode the ISO codes or risk purchasing the wrong insert.

Probably, the only other thing you might consider is a live centre but the dead centres that will come with it will get you by for a while.

If you have not been to Hare and Forbes, I would recommend you go in person to buy your lathe as you will probably screw some extras out of them on the day. The salesman promised me 10% off on any tooling I buy and has been true to his word... Hit them up for a bottle of lathe oil...

Finally, the stands that come with the lathes are not very stable. If you buy one, you must bolt it down to stop this happening which has prompted me to make a new lathe stand for my lathe. Hopefully, I will get it finished this weekend.

Thanks, that helped a lot. I didn't even know you could get a tail stock chuck till now, I was just talking about a drill chuck. I am going to make my own stand out of HRS instead of buying one.

Originally Posted by DarBee

Hi Alaks,

I agree with the for-posters. I find just a keyed 13mm 3MT chuck in the tailstock is plenty.
The stand is solid enough, but bolt it down and make sure plenty of silicone around the feet of the lathe bed before fitting it onto the tray - stops leaking into the cabinet.
I also agree that you need to negotiate the best deal you can for yourself. If you agree to pay the full price for the lathe, ask them to firstly throw in a 4-jaw for nix, then ask them to add a good discount on the rest (tools & holders etc).

I mentioned in your other thread that found my 250G in the H&F throwout aisle for 1/2 price - they still gave me lots of the other stuff well discounted. Tell them you have a 50 year machining life ahead and will be therefore GOOD for H&F in the long term!

Always remember when negotiating, everyone will always sell something to you ifthey want to. Good Luck.

Daryl

I didn't know you could bargen like that, thanks.

There was a thread on the forum a while ago on a stand built for the AL250G. It was made from RHS with wood inserts. I copied it for mine and added a draw as well as feet to bolt it down. I bought a live centre from ozmestore 1 and a 4 jaw from H&F when I bought the lathe. I use a keyless chuck, haven't noticed a lack of space, but if your going to do some long work you'll probably gain an extra inch or so.

Originally Posted by rodweb

which has prompted me to make a new lathe stand for my lathe. Hopefully, I will get it finished this weekend.

Who's lathe was that and do you know how it happened?
My 12 x 36 lathe is on a similar stand and I had it bolted down for around 6 years, but since not having it bolted down I haven't had any problems with tipping over and it has leveling feet on it as well.

Dave

If this turns up as a duplicate, please delete it. Something funny happened.

Originally Posted by Dave J

Who's lathe was that and do you know how it happened?
My 12 x 36 lathe is on a similar stand and I had it bolted down for around 6 years, but since not having it bolted down I haven't had any problems with tipping over and it has leveling feet on it as well.


Dave

Dave, it is mine and its only 4 months old. I move it away from the wall to drill some holes in the splash guard to mount a coolant spout and as I moved the tailstock end back into position, the other heavy end went down. Part of my problem has been that I don't have a level floor. I tried to add levelling feet to the stand when I first bought it but it was so unstable I removed them.


I painted my new stand tonight but this is what I am working on



i hope to have the lathe on top of it by the end of this weekend but there is a bit of fiddling around to get it sorted as I hope it ends up with removable wheels.

Originally Posted by Dave J

Who's lathe was that and do you know how it happened?

Dave

Wow, bad karma there. Hope no one got hurt.

Those poxy little narrow gutted stands are horrible.

I remember looking at a big lathe in Gasweld that was sitting on a wooden pallet, and when I went to check out the cross slide travel it moved so badly I thought it was going to topple out through the plate glass shop window. Frightened the bejeezus out of me.

A 6" four jaw chuck is best option for a ten inch swing lathe IMHO as it gives you more scope for mounting eccentric work etc.

That's what I've got in addition to the basic 5 " three jaw. But as stated you need a backing plate for a large chuck.

Rob

How much damage?

Originally Posted by rodweb

If this turns up as a duplicate, please delete it. Something funny happened.




Dave, it is mine and its only 4 months old. I move it away from the wall to drill some holes in the splash guard to mount a coolant spout and as I moved the tailstock end back into position, the other heavy end went down. Part of my problem has been that I don't have a level floor. I tried to add levelling feet to the stand when I first bought it but it was so unstable I removed them.


I painted my new stand tonight but this is what I am working on



i hope to have the lathe on top of it by the end of this weekend but there is a bit of fiddling around to get it sorted as I hope it ends up with removable wheels.

I like the way you are doing it, that would be simaller to the way I would do it but I would probably use 4'' HRS.

I hope the lathe didn't get much damage.

That stand looks really great and I for one would like to see pictures of it finished.

I am planing something similar using a draws, but still want deep draws for the chucks each end. I have the 2mm sheet here for it but am tossing up whether to use a tool box or make my own draws with heavy home made runners.

The Maxum tool boxes I bought would be great as they are heavy duty, but there pricey at $400 for a top box and $600 for a bottom box. I am just wondering if they would even take the weight of 50 odd tool holders loaded with tools which is why I am thinking of home made runners with real bearings.

Back on topic the 12 x 36 lathes are supplied with a 160mm 3 jaw and a 200mm 4 jaw, I fitted a 250mm chuck but it's only for the one off jobs and keep it under 1000 rpm.

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/fi...-lathe-121922/

Dave

Can I have the lengths of the Al-250g? I would like to make a table so that I have something to put it on, I will use the drip tray so I need all of the sizes and it would help to have the hight from the bottom of the lathe to the center of the spindle so I know what hight to make the bench.

I just looked at the specs: L149 | AL-250G Bench Lathe | machineryhouse.com.au
I don't like that a 4 jaw is optional. I would insist on it's inclusion. As to size, my 250mm swing lathe originally had a 150mm 3 jaw and a 200mm 4 jaw (which I didn't get), so 200 is ok, but probably the biggest you'd want. I fitted a 150mm 4 jaw and it's fine. I wouldn't go smaller.

My other concern is the spindle nose, which is described as 'fixed'. I don't know what that means. If it means threaded that would put me off this machine. A camlock spindle is desirable because it allows you to use reverse without fear of the chuck unscrewing and attacking you. But maybe as a beginner this is a limitation you would accept.

I hope you have read enough by now to know that you should not expect this machine to be high quality, though it may be adequate as an affordable first lathe. Do some googling on the model to see what sort of issues to expect.

PS: The instruction manual at the above link gives the length as 1130mm.