Thread: how many do we have?

So what tool comes with a Ruby?

Originally Posted by hughie

Agreed, its a term or carry over from another time when the apprentice actually paid for his tuition. The apprenticship papers/contract are called indenture papers and define length and conditions along with usually what is supposed to be taught etc.

I saw a comment that Allan Batty was the only living indentured wood turner in England today and it set me thinking and wondering

Furthermore, the original contracts were written longhand and signed by both parties. The term indentured arose because, to prevent forgery and other chicanery, the contract was then cut in half and each signatory took a part. The cut was made as a waveyline; i.e. it had INDENTATIONS, hence the term indentured.

The same process was used for other contracts.

Seems to have little to dowith teeth.

I wasn't aware that an apprenticeship in woodturning was available. I would have thought it would have been included as part of a patternmaker or cabinetmaker apprenticeship. You can't do an apprenticeship as a milling machine operator or metal lathe operator, they're just part of a fitting/machining/toolmaker apprenticeship.
Went looking for mine, still got 'em, although it's called a "Certificate of Prophicency".

Attachment 180920

I doubt there would be many in Australia as cnc has taken over pretty much.
Another factor is most of the cnc stuff now comes from China (the country, not our member). I believe from a wonky memories (ahh the late 60's early 70's) most were employed in the pattern making or cabinet making industry as GJ said.
Pete

Maybe I am the closest thing to an indentured wood turner then. Although I don't know when I will in fact know enough to say I know enough. We ( and I )haven't exactly got a scheduled of what has to be learned or anything. We just do what comes in the door. And I don't go to trade school or anything! Maybe I should?

TL you've certainly swept enough floors, made enough cups of tea/coffee, done enough errands and been made to wear ridiculous PPE to qualify as an apprentice .

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

TL you've certainly swept enough floors, made enough cups of tea/coffee, done enough errands and been made to wear ridiculous PPE to qualify as an apprentice .

I can't agree with you cos I think has a computer at the Canberra show.

Unfortunately there is no apprenticeship for Woodturners as such in Vic but it comes in Wood Machinig if I remember rightly.

NSW had the only pure Woodturning Apprenticeship but it was absorbed into another course.

Maybe some of the NSW woodturners could comment.

I know 1/2 dozen turners that were indentured turners in NSW,

Dredging up what I can recall of reading about the history ...

Craft guilds emerged from the Merchant guilds in the middle ages or later.

Typically a Master craftsman would train his son or sons in the craft, but could also take on someone else's. Who would live with the master and the payment would cover board for what could be up to seven years.

At that point the apprentice would aim to acquire journeyman status. There's some debate about what this meant. Either travel and work for other masters to gain experience, or be paid by the day for work in the workshop (from the French 'journee' which means 'day'.)

Next step was to acquire Master status which involved producing one or more 'masterpieces' which were examined by the Guild.

Technologically and commercially it was a closed shop, with the Guild determining prices, working hours and production methods.

There's some evidence of women occasionally inheriting their father's workshop and continuing the business, and some evidence of a strong female presence in eg. weaving.

So maybe in a few instances, a form of social PPE was a long skirt.

TL, might be worth a try ;-}

George Hatfield would be the bloke to talk to.

Contributors

My trade apprenticeship indenture document was signed by both parties (me and my boss and witnesses) on 04/02/57, and that was for five years.

George Hatfield tells me that the wood turning centre of the Sydney Technical College, the last wood turning trade training school, has been closed and is very unlikely to re-open as a wood turning trade centre. Two machines have been kept as part of other trade training courses.

Wood turning as a trade is pretty much dead, too much competition from reproduction machines have cut the guts out of the prices and market for professional turners is too small.

There are very few people left who can make a living turning wood on a "standard" lathe.

So now it is up to us amateurs to make the few chair and table legs, now required.
Jim

Originally Posted by rsser

So maybe in a few instances, a form of social PPE was a long skirt.

TL, might be worth a try ;-}

I don' t think OH&S allows a skirt in a wood work shop.

Up ladders maybe.

My trade apprenticeship indenture document was signed by both parties (me and my boss and witnesses) on 04/02/57, and that was for five years.

Yep mine was very much the same other than my father had to sign as well as I was a minor [16 ].

Originally Posted by tea lady

I don' t think OH&S allows a skirt in a wood work shop.

Up ladders maybe.

You only get ladders in your stockings TL and also, it might pay
you to check up the rules on "indenture" ... you might find you no
longer have to make mud cakes for and there could also be
a pay rise for you.

Allan